Class of 2012 has arrived on campus

Indiana incoming freshman point guard Yogi Ferrell posted on his Twitter account that “#TheMovement is here!”

What that means, of course is that Indiana’s Class of 2012, which coined the phrase “The Movement,” to stand for Indiana’s run of highly-ranked in-state recruits, has arrived on campus.Forward Hanner Mosquera-Perea and center Peter Jurkin had already been on campus for a week. Ferrell, guard Ron Patterson and swingman Jeremy Hollowell participated in last week’s Indiana All-Star series and graduated before arriving on campus on Wednesday.

All five still have to be cleared by the NCAA clearinghouse — and the Guy-Marc Michel situation proved that certain situations could not be ironed out until the beginning of the season or close to it — but their arrival on campus suggests that Indiana and coach Tom Crean presume that they will all be qualified. By formally enrolling — which they won’t do officially until Monday – they begin their five-year clock, so that effectively precludes any of the five from postponing enrollment for prep school.

And this of course means that there are 14 scholarship players on campus and only 13 scholarships for them.

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  • Podunker says:

    Dustin, I assume you’re including Roth as one of the 14? As was beaten to death last week, I think most people believe Roth will not be on next year’s roster.

    But for the sake of discussion, what are Crean’s options? What are the rules that govern these situations? Is it Crean’s choice as to who gets a scholarship and who does not?

    I know it’s difficult to speculate, but if Roth wants to play and Crean wants to keep him for another year, who is most likely to get the boot? Based on this story, it’s not going to be anyone that is a part of The Movement. And if it’s not Roth, what impact does that have on the player that get’s cut?

  • I’m not including Roth as one of the 14. He would make 15. I’m presuming at this point, he is not returning. To wit, without Roth, the roster includes.
    Class of 2009
    1. Jordan Hulls
    2. Christian Watford
    3. Derek Elston
    4. Maurice Creek
    Class of 2010
    5. Victor Oladipo
    6. Will Sheehey
    Class of 2011
    7. Cody Zeller
    8. Austin Etherington
    9. Remy Abell
    Class of 2012
    10. Yogi Ferrell
    11. Ron Patterson
    12. Jeremy Hollowell
    13. Hanner Perea
    14. Peter Jurkin

    I know only this. The players become counters as of the beginning of the fall semester. That’s when he’s officially over the limit. I don’t even know what the penalty is for that, but that’s his deadline.

  • Podunker says:

    Thanks, Dustin. And if I recall, red-shirting does not resolve the problem.

    My guess is that one of the freshman will not qualify this year or two of the older players will be leaving soon. What other possible scenarios are there?

  • Reggie says:

    I really want to see all of these guys. Maybe somebody will walk-on?

  • That is correct. Redshirting will not solve the problem.
    My guess, at this point, is that all of the freshmen will qualify. At least academically. I talked to some people with Indiana Elite and they said Perea and Jurkin are both very safely academically qualified and they don’t have anything specific to fear, but you simply never know what the Clearinghouse will find to squabble about when it comes to foreign players. There was some noise going around about Hollowell and Patterson not qualifying, but they both told me point blank that they’re fine. If they weren’t I can’t imagine they would have enrolled. When Maurice Creek was on shaky ground with his SAT scores, he just didn’t enroll until September and waited until he was cleared. Crean said recently that he was still waiting on final transcripts. I don’t know if he got them or not, but there’s no question he has enough academic data on them that if he knew they weren’t going to qualify he would have pushed the prep school option and those guys wouldn’t be in Bloomington.
    If Roth doesn’t return, Crean only has to make one more opening, and that of course is the difficult part because the Creek recovery has at least some tenuousness to it. If he comes back to health, I’m not sure what he’s going to do. Apparently, no one wants to leave, because if they did, they would’ve left by now. And if Crean were to decide to move somebody, there’s no dead weight there. Look up and down that list and consider ramifications for 2013 and beyond. Is there anyone you’d feel comfortable pushing off? Don’t say Etherington or Abell, because Crean has made it clear he likes them both. He still needs Elston too, because without him he’s relying on freshmen for all of his reserve post minutes. And obviously, when it comes to Hulls, Watford, Oladipo, Sheehey and Zeller, you’re talking about starters.
    I really don’t know how this gets fixed, unless they decide Creek isn’t going to make it back. I don’t entirely understand how it would work for a player to come off scholarship and play as a walk-on. I’m not ruling that out because I don’t know the rules there, but I don’t think anyone’s going to jump at the chance to pay $10 grand or so.

  • Hoosier Clarion says:

    I am betting the man that draws the short straw is in the middle of the 4 year pack.

  • Reggie says:

    Didn’t the Hulls family say a while back that if Gary Harris signed with Indiana they would pay for a year of Jordy’s school? Remy Abell better not transfer because he’s gonna be important next year. AE will be important his junior and senior years. I think Elston or Creek will transfer. Or in Creek’s case give up basketball. It’s really sad but it’s got to be said. Remember the guy on MSU a few years ago that had the knee problems and had to quit college basketball? It’s a shame what happened to MO. He could have been one of the best shooters in the Big 10.

  • Someone pointed this out on the blog last week at some point. According to the NCAA manual, the institution is obligated to inform all returning student athletes by July 1 if their scholarship will be renewed. However, the rule allows for “reconsideration of nonrenewal,” which means you can tell a player he isn’t getting his scholarship renewed and then tell him later that he will.
    So by my interpretation (I should get a compliance officer for their interpretation, because I often think I know what I’m reading the NCAA manual but am not as certain as I think I am) what this means is that by July 1, there has to be some kind of move. They might have to tell one player he’s paying his own way if Creek returns. But that still gives them the possibility of giving him the scholarship back if Creek does not return.

  • Reggie,
    If the Hulls family said that, they didn’t say it publicly (They couldn’t, because it would be an NCAA violation). But anyway, I heard that rumor, too, and I’m not saying it is or isn’t true, but I can tell you that Hulls is very much operating under the assumption that he will have his first year of graduate school paid for by scholarship.

  • To clarify, the Hulls family paying for school would not have been an NCAA violation, but publicly declaring that they were doing it for the sake of signing Gary Harris would be a violation if he were mentioned by name.

  • Hoosier Clarion says:

    Derek Elston as a 4 year Senior will not be going anywhere.

  • Podunker says:

    The process of elimination combined with simple logic suggests that Creek will be leaving. Otherwise, either Etherington or Abell will be leaving, or someone is giving up their scholarship for a year.

    It will be interesting to see how this plays out.

  • Harvard for Hillbillies says:

    Most likely it’s ‘hasta la vista’ for Elston and Roth.

    I would get rid of Sheehey and Etherington.

    Sheehey thinks he’s too good and Etherington is only in Bloomington because he takes the top bunk in Cody’s dorm.

  • Podunker says:

    Nope, I doubt it will be Sheehey or Elston. Too much experience and playing time last year. You need Elston for the big bodies in the Big Ten and you have to remember that Crean sited the arrival of Sheehey and Oladipo as changing the culture and work ethic of the team. That’s code for saying they brought “leadership” and “toughness” to the team.

    Look at playing time for last year. Those players with the least amount of PT are arguably the least valuable players on the team and therefore the most likely to get cut. If Creek’s legs will allow him to play at a high level, you have to assume Crean see’s him as having more upside than either Etherington or Abell. If Creek’s legs won’t allow him to play this year, you have to assume he’s going to get cut.

  • Harvard for Hillbillies says:

    I didn’t say it would be Sheehey…It’s a ruthless process and if ruthlessness was needed from my doorstep, then I would cut Sheehey and Etherington.

    I don’t think Sheehey is suited for the fast pace we’ll be playing(witnessed too many mistakes in traffic last year) and Etherington was a charity case from the beginning…We all know that. I give Roth another year before I hand out more charity awards..Sheehey’s big ego will be just fine at Florida International.

    I see Abell, Creek, and Roth far more valuable to our needs.

    Now, who did I think will be gone?…As I said above, Elston and Roth.

  • Podunker says:

    “I would get rid of Sheehey and Etherington.”

    I didn’t say that you said it would be those guys. I responded to what you said you would do. In fact, I did not pose the question ‘what would you do,” I simply explored the logic of which players are most likely to be cut in hopes of generating different insights from other posters.

    Given the circumstances, I can’t imagine Roth being with the team next year.

  • Geoff says:

    I can imagine Roth being back, but only in a non-scholarship scenario. If he wants to have grad school paid for he’s gonna have to transfer.

    If I had to guess, I’d say the other odd man out would be Creek. It isn’t too big a deal to come back after one knee issue and one year lost, but multiple knee issues to both knees and multiple years lost… I just don’t see how he ends up contributing with all the youth and talent in the program right now. Why take time away from someone who will be an important player for 3 or 4 more years to attempt a science project with Creek?

    I think the next most obvious choice would be Etherington. There are just so many players, some with more experience and others with more upside, that will take up those minutes. The next year there will be even more depth on the wing with Davis and Hartman coming in. I can see a situation where Austin chooses to stay as a walk-on just because he always wanted to be a Hoosier and Zeller and the Movement are all his boys. Does anyone know his family situation?

    I think the 3rd guy would be Abell, simply because he is replaceable. With guys likeYogi, Patterson, and Robinson coming into the program you can afford to lose Abell. It sucks. It’s not like I want to see him go. I enjoy watching him play and think he has potential, but he’s more replaceable than other guys.

    Lastly I just can’t imagine that Elston will be the guy to go. First, he is an experienced big man. Second, he was actually pretty tough on defense last year. Third, he was a knock down shooter when healthy (I mean really lights out!), so he brings a different dimension than any of the other players that can guard post players. Lastly, he is a senior and I think it would be unusual to move a senior who has been a contributing player during his career.

    So all that means is that it will probably end up being Elston…

  • Chet says:

    Roth and Creek.


  • Harvard for Hillbillies says:

    You don’t cut a kid that already had his career likely destroyed by two blown out knees.

    The only reason you’re suggesting Abell is to spite me, Geoff. Only kid that keeps me hangin’ on. Humble baller that rescued us in many situations last year with nothing but unselfish desires to better his team..What more do you want? He’s everything Kentucky isn’t and what a great symbol of what it means to be a Hoosier in the face of the obnoxious man now at UK?

    Crean never gave Elston his needed development early on..He was a Sampson recruit and expendable..Crean was always most concerned with giving Doc River’s boy playing time in hopes some rare shot at Austin.

    Probably the best thing for Derek would be to finish out where he’s appreciated. He is a great shooter but at times his engine is running faster than his abilities(much of that is due to the hours lost in PT during his first two years..over-pumped..over-performance anxiety).

    Shame on you for suggesting Remy…That hits me in a very dark place and all know what a depressing soul I am already. Thanks a bunch for that. Remy Remix forever.

  • Geoff says:

    Abell was not said in spite. I justified my answers quite well. Like I said, tough choices need to made, and he is more replaceable than other players. I still think he is with the team next year because I think Creek is out. Remy is 4th on my list after Roth, Creek, and Austin… Sorry if that offends you.

    Aren’t Elston and Creek the same class? Doesn’t that mean they were both recruited by the same coaching staff? That is a serious question. I really don’t know/remember the answer. Point is, if that’s true why show favoritism to Creek?

    I agree about your assessment of Elston’s motor, and I think you and I have had that convo before. However, I’m still trying to find why you think Elston is the one. I think it was injuries always holding Elston back, not Crean. Last year he started the year healthy, got good minutes and shot something like 70% (on jump shots) over the first 5 or 6 games. Then got dinged up and his time was severely cut back. However, once he got healthy about 2/3 of the way through the season Crean once again started giving him quality minutes – having a 10-game stretch where he averaged about 18 minutes, shot over 50% FG, and went an amazing 8-12 from 3-pt land.

    When you can tell me who else on the 2012-13 roster can guard a center and legit be counted on to hit 50% from 3-pt land, then I’ll agree that Elston will be the guy to go.

  • BeatPurdue says:

    These posts prove that most fans on this blog are idiots. All 14 plus Roth, as a 15th, have shown that they can play, that they work hard at improving, that they are quality kids, that they are quality students, etc. Coach Crean, pull a rabbit out of a hat! I like each and every one of them. But Roth will have to be a walk-on, and he may have better options.

  • TsaoTsuG says:

    Whoever it is, I hope Crean has some creative way for us to get out of this mess with some elegance. I can almost accept Roth (not like it, but accept it given he’s already completed two- is it two?- graduate degrees). But, whatever the outcome, it would be an injustice to whoever it is, and send a terrible message about our program.

    We should also stop guessing and discussing this issue in terms of ‘who should we get rid of?’. The speculation is centered on selecting and discussing the negatives about players who have all given a lot to the Hoosiers at a time when believing in the Hoosiers was a commodity in very short supply. It’s disrespectful and shameful and will come back to bite us. It makes the Hoosier basketball program look as if it lacks integrity and respect for our players.

    Crean should be very careful about a decision; but, he should address it as soon as it is possible to end this kind of speculation. He needs to be very conscious that this situation goes right to the heart of the issues he twitters about.

  • Geoff says:

    Sweet! So out of:


    Which of us are idiots? And why?

    The only disparaging remark I saw was Harvard calling Sheehey an egomaniac.

    I like the strong opinion, though… Can you elaborate just a touch?

  • Geoff says:

    Tsao – I completely trust Crean to handle the situation with elegance, don’t you? From what I can tell, we have a team full of high-character individuals, so even if the player is offended or taken off-guard by being left out, I believe that it would be handled with class on their end as well.

    It’s also what makes it that much tougher… Knowing your going to disappoint someone who is a deserving and contributing member of the “family.”

    As far as the ‘getting rid of’ comment… The only one framing it as such was Harvard. And satire is kinda his thing, so good luck getting him to change his style.

  • Laffy says:

    I’d be amazed if it’s Elston. How many kids leave after their junior year? Next to zero?

    I agree that if Creek isn’t healthy, he’s probably gone.

    Don;t know why Etherington is staying since he will never, and I mean never, see the floor.

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