Roth moving on

106 comments by   |   Sunday, August 26, 2012 - 6:20 pm EDT

Though Matt Roth was at Assembly Hall on Saturday for Tom Crean’s basketball camp, the two did not discuss the possibility of Roth returning for a fifth season. At this point, though, Roth doesn’t need such a conversation to process the obvious.

Indiana started classes last week and without him in the picture, the Hoosiers have 13 players on scholarship, which is exactly the NCAA limit. Roth, who already has a bachelor’s degree and a master’s degree, isn’t enrolled for the fall semester, and has accepted the fact that his college basketball career is over.

“School has started, and they’ve got their guys that are there on scholarship,” Roth said. “They’ve got the right number of guys. I’m not enrolled and I’m not on scholarship. I never told them I was ready to move on, but I gotta look out for my best interest now. There’s no sense in hoping. I don’t know if it’s even possible now.”

Roth said he and Crean spoke briefly at camp, but he didn’t want to pull Crean away from coaching the young players at the camp. Roth said even though Crean didn’t directly address his status, he did tell Roth to use him as a reference for any job applications. He said he appreciated that, but it also allowed him to read between the lines.

“You kind of put one and one together there,” Roth said.

Roth had a fifth year of eligibility because he broke his foot two games in to his sophomore season and didn’t return the rest of the year. That made him eligible for a medical redshirt. It was widely presumed that he would not get the opportunity for a fifth year because Indiana was oversigned by one for the 2012-13 season even without him in the fold. He took part in Senior Day festivities at Indiana’s last home game, but after a brilliant senior season off the bench in which he shot a Big Ten best 54.5 percent from beyond the 3-point arc and helped the Hoosiers to the Sweet 16, Crean told him to keep his options heading into his fifth year. By NCAA rule, Roth would have been given the opportunity to transfer to another Division I school without penalty for his fifth year because he had already graduated. However, Roth opted not to do that and hoped that a scholarship would open up for him to return to Indiana.

Incoming freshman guard Ron Patterson lost his faculty sponsorship because of a difficult summer session academically and was not admitted, but no other scholarship opened up, which left Roth on the outside looking in. His next move, he said, is to try to find a job. That will be difficult because he wants to work in athletic administration and there are few jobs to be found with the school year and college football season beginning.

“It’s going to be tough to find something,” he said. “But I’m being optimistic. I might have to take a job that isn’t in my field and make it work for a couple of years, or maybe I find something that I’ve never thought about that hits home as something I’d want to do.”

Despite the bind it could put him in, Roth said he didn’t regret waiting out the summer to see if he could return.

“I knew I wasn’t ready to be completely done,” he said. “But at the end of the day, I gave it everything I had for four years here. And at the end of the day, that’s what people are going to remember.”

 

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106 comments:
#1
Rantool
Sunday, August 26, 2012 - 8:24 PM EDT

Matt is a class kid with an awesome stroke! Wishing him nothing but the best. He was one of the guys who was instrimental in helping put Indiana basketball back on the map, and for that I say thank you, Matt!

 
#2
KevinK
Sunday, August 26, 2012 - 8:49 PM EDT

Thank you Matt!!
Best of Luck in all your future endeavors.

 
#3
Debbie
Sunday, August 26, 2012 - 9:15 PM EDT

Matt is a class act and handles himself very well in interviews. Deep down he has to be hurting, especially since he stuck with us and never wavered in his commitment. Too bad our coach didn’t stick by him. I’d tell coach to shove his reference where the sun doesn’t shine. Matt should at minimum have a job at IU somewhere and Crean could influence that if he really wanted to.

 
#4
Ron (florida)
Sunday, August 26, 2012 - 9:20 PM EDT

Sad, but he did make the most of his time. Like the IU job idea, but at this point he may not be interested.

Dustin, nice article in the paper today.

 
#5
psych
Sunday, August 26, 2012 - 9:46 PM EDT

Good luck, Matt. I was never more confident in someone making a key 3-pointer for the Hoosiers since Kyle Hornsby roamed Assembly Hall back in the early 2000s. It is time for you to put those two awesome degrees from IU to good work.

 
#6
Jackie
Sunday, August 26, 2012 - 9:49 PM EDT

I don’t think Matt should have held out hope. He went through senior night and that should have ended a great career on a positive note. I think he was thinking with his heart and not his head. Love the guy but I don’t think he should have played the sad little puppy act. Crean can’t keep everyone nor give every dedicated kid a job.

 
#7
WSJ
Sunday, August 26, 2012 - 9:54 PM EDT

Matt is a class kid. Im starting to worry about the character of Crean. He screws over Patterson and Roth in the same year because of his own mistake to over sign. I love IU, but Crean is losing me a little bit.

 
#8
Max
Sunday, August 26, 2012 - 9:59 PM EDT

I am a long-time Hoosier, but live in Seattle now since 2005. U. of Wash. could use a shooter, but I don’t know if they have any scholarships left. They start school well after Labor Day, don’t know exactly when. Roth would be a great addition. I go to lots of UW games.

 
#9
Sam Fortune
Sunday, August 26, 2012 - 10:00 PM EDT

Really not a cool way to treat a kid who has given everything to this program. What is Coach thinking with this? I don’t understand how a kid gives 4+ years of his life to a program and then gets basically shown the door with not so much as a thanks on the way out. What is this? Why are we doing this to our kids? Shameful.

 
#10 Sunday, August 26, 2012 - 10:20 PM EDT

Later, Matt. You’ll always be part of the IU family.

 
#11
TsaoTsuG
Sunday, August 26, 2012 - 10:24 PM EDT

Dustin- Am I to understand that Tom Crean has not yet approached the subject of the availability or no availability of a scholarship with Matt Roth? Based on your story, is the last word given to ROth ‘to hold his options open? Just to be sure, I’d ;ike this clarification. Thank you.

 
#12
Bobby
Sunday, August 26, 2012 - 10:38 PM EDT

@WSJ. What in the world are you talking about? “Screwing Roth and Patterson over”? If you would just look at the facts, Patterson did not make grades and Roth did not enroll in school, you would see that there is nothing going on here.

 
#13
Bobby
Sunday, August 26, 2012 - 10:40 PM EDT

@Sam Fortune. Could you be more of a drama queen? “Shown the door without a thanks.” Give us a break. Did you watch senior night last year? My guess is no based on your over-the-top post.

 
#14 Sunday, August 26, 2012 - 11:30 PM EDT

We’re the #1 team in the country so why are we letting Matt Roth divide the fan base?

 
#15
IlliniGuy
Sunday, August 26, 2012 - 11:33 PM EDT

It’s bad enough that Crean is runnning Roth off, but to not even communicate this with him? That makes it 10X worse.

 
#16
Chet
Sunday, August 26, 2012 - 11:50 PM EDT

Poor kid. Only got one undergraduate and one graduate degree. With his connections he’ll probably be lucky to pull down $100,000 a year. Maybe we can put up jars at convenience stores for him.

I feel so dirty.

 
#17
Harvard for Hillbillies
Sunday, August 26, 2012 - 11:51 PM EDT

Goodbye Matt.

 
#18 Monday, August 27, 2012 - 1:28 AM EDT

Tsao,
Based on what Roth said as of the time this post was written, yes. Roth told me the discussions had progressed no further than that and he hadn’t heard anything specific, but he obviously saw the writing on the wall. Plus, Crean did say something about Roth using him as a reference. Now, they were apparently both at some sort of function at Fort Wayne Sunday evening, so I can’t say if they spoke after I talked to him, but I talked to Matt about 20-30 minutes before this post went up and that was what he said.

 
#19 Monday, August 27, 2012 - 1:29 AM EDT

Thanks, Ron, for reading. And for purchasing.

 
#20
TsaoTsuG
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 2:16 AM EDT

Thanks Dustin. I believe that the Patterson issue is the responsibility of young Mr. Patterson. I wish him a good future. He was given every legitimate chance to qualify for admission at IU but something did not click. In no way can we hold Tom Crean responsible for that. The Faculty committee, based on A.D. Glass’ report, acted as it must- independently.

I also believe the math and that points to someone falling by the wayside scholarship-wise. There were fourteen players eligible for thirteen scholarships.

It seems to me that if there was no way out of the dilemma, it was up to Tom Crean to be as up-front as possible with Matt Roth about his situation. As described here and before, that did not happen (if Matt description of the relationship and conversations with Crean as conveyed to Dustin are accurate). If nothing else, in my opinion, Matt earned the right through his loyalty, sacrifice and performance for a stand-up and timely answer from his coach and mentor.

I really do hope that Crean sees fit to comment on this situation, openly. I would be interested on how he sees it in the context of his values and beliefs.

 
#21
Craig
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 3:37 AM EDT

Btw..Lorenzo Romar and Washington have 3 open rides..they had a highly touted JUCO Guard leave unexpectedly-McLaughlin or something. But I think Matt wanted to play only for IU.Very disappointing-I emailed Coach Crean’s office just to ask if they had poss. a Graduate Assistant’s spot for him somewhere inside of the Athletic dept. and Imploring him as a Fan to PLEASE at least call Matt and talk with him. I linked his TV interview to the email.

Dosent sound like he did-and that’s disappointing.Matt will find something Good ahead-i’m sure..as smart and talented as he is.He might want to think ab.going overseas and making some $ shooting 3′s in a top league somewhere. Crean-if he didnt even give Matt a call this summmer on this, I dont think he handled it very well and would tell him that to his face,honestly and respectfully. And that’s,on him.

He’s a man of Faith-so am I.And all due respect, but I dont think that’s wwjd. Roth’s given his ALL to IU-at least give him the respect of a meeting-or lol at least a phone call. Best wishes to Matt-a Great Indiana Hoosier. Aloha Friends!#TakeCareofYourPlayersCoach.

 
#22
Hoosier Clarion
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 8:30 AM EDT

After enjoying his Senior night MR was told to leave his options open for the up coming season because situations unknown then could happen later. He did and they did. Sound advise by Coach Crean. I have no formal degree and figured out how this could end for Matt. He has 2 and I am sure he figured it out before me. Craig has stated Romar has rides available. What a great gig for a 5th year shooter. “Go NW young man go NW”.

 
#23
Mike
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 8:36 AM EDT

I have to say, I’m really surprised at the lack of communication on the part of Crean. I would think, in general, he talks to his players more often – even his former players. Certainly someone that he told to keep his options open. Kind of disappointed in hearing this about our coach. And he says he can use him as a reference? Shouldn’t that be something that doesn’t need to be said?

 
#24
Hoosier Clarion
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 8:44 AM EDT

I would never presume to have a personal reference w/o asking for it.

 
#25
slojoe
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 9:27 AM EDT

I can hardly blame MR for hanging on as long as possible for the chance to play on a national championship contender. But it just didn’t work out. There seems to be no animosity on the part of MR toward IU or Crean, and I see no reason to stir any thing up on that front. IMHO MR will profit greatly from his years at IU and relationship with Crean. The “rest of the story” is still to be written.

 
#26
Wisco
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 9:35 AM EDT

Dustin…was it an option for Roth to walk-on? I know that’s a pride thing (in addition to $) with college athletes, and I understand that, but I’m surprised he didn’t want to do that if it were an option. What is the minimum graduate credit hours an athlete must take in order to be full-time/NCAA eligible? 6-8? So like $5000 for the year or less? I know that’s a decent amount of coin, but given the situation, I’m surprised he didn’t just do that. Hate to see him go, but also understand that’s the nature of the beast in big-time college sports.

 
#27
Wisco
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 9:37 AM EDT

Had also heard a rumor (so it could be completely false) that Cincinnati (and likely others) was interested in Roth, but he wanted to be a Hoosier for life and held out. Thus, making me wonder even more about the walk-on possibility.

 
#28
Sam
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 9:44 AM EDT

I hope this situation never happens again but I beleive it will. Two things that stand out are, 1) Coach Crean seems to have avoided the issue until it disappeared. I think he owed it to Roth to come out and just say there is no spot for him. I have yet to see anything to indicate that happened. As the head coach, that’s on you Coach Crean to not leave the kid hanging. 2) It does not seem like Roth ever flat out asked about a spot. This also seems odd. It really sounds more like he was not going to ask and just hoping it worked out. Plus, he was no willing to walk on and pay to continue playing and go on for another degree. His choice. Either way, this was not the best way it could be handled and both sides need to do better. IU fans expect more.

 
#29
boilerdowd
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 9:58 AM EDT

Roth is a class act…he handled it as gracefully as anyone could. Crean, on the other hand is a complete fraud- he talks about doing things the right way in pep rallies and on Twitter, but when he had the chance to merely talk to a kid who literally bled for him and the program, he can’t even speak to him about being persona non grata. Those of you who are denying Crean’s real character are deceiving yourselves.

 
#30 Monday, August 27, 2012 - 10:15 AM EDT

Wisco,
I asked Roth about walking on when I talked to him about two weeks ago. He basically said the idea hadn’t really crossed his mind at that point. He said he wasn’t even sure if that was legal from a compliance perspective, to play as a walk-on for the fifth year after taking a medical redshirt (I can’t imagine there’s a rule that prohibits it). I guess to be completely accurate, I’d say that it had to be an option because I can’t see anything that would prohibit it, but it was not an option that was presented to him. I’d say it would’ve been something he would’ve looked into closer if he didn’t already have not one but two degrees. He’s an out-of-state student, of course, so no matter how many classes he was taking, there would be additional expense there. I can’t say how much it would have cost him. But when I asked him about it, he did mention the expense.

 
#31
Milla
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 12:55 PM EDT

Hey boilerdowd, remember when you had 3 really good players a few years ago? And then they didn’t accomplish anything? That was pretty cool. Now IU is going to a few Final Fours again. That also is pretty cool.

No worries, you will have 3 good players again when you are like 80 years old.

 
#32
Podunker
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 2:29 PM EDT

Wow, the comments of some of the posters on this string are simply astounding. I read the word “sacrifice” used in reference to Roth playing for IU. That is simply absurd. Playing BB on a full-ride scholarship at a school like Indiana is an honor, it’s not a sacrifice. I’ll bet Roth’s four years of IU BB were the four best years of his life. If Roth made such a sacrifice, why was he interested in coming back for a fifth season? How in the world was anything that Matt Roth did with IU BB a sacrifice? Unbelievable drivel!

Some of these posts just go to show that some people will use the smallest issue to vent their spleen against Tom Crean. Logic is not required, facts are irrelevant, and their common sense is overruled by cynicism. I respect anyone who believes Crean was wrong to over-sign players. That’s a legitimate concern, even though it’s a common practice and Crean he obviously followed the rules. But the over-signing had nothing to do with Roth. Roth was done at IU. He had his four years and he got two degrees. TWO DEGREES! Good bye, we love you, but we have to move on. To accuse Crean of treating Roth badly is sentimental drivel. Four years, an undergraduate degree, a masters degree, being honored at senior night, and a personal reference for his job search, and Roth is a victim? Wow, no wonder, with so many people having an “entitlement mentality,” the fabric of our society is beginning to disintegrate. Matt Roth was not entitled to play basketball at IU for a fifth year and I see no evidence that he was treated badly by Tom Crean.

My only criticism of Crean regarding the Roth matter, with the benefit of hind site, was that he should have told Roth last spring, in no uncertain terms, “Matt, you will not be offered a scholarship for your fifth year. If there is any chance of you playing for a fifth year, it will have to be as a walk on, and that assumes we have a spot on the roster, which is looking less and less likely. You’re welcome to keep your options open, but I recommend you move on with your life.” That’s what Crean should have said to Matt Roth. But I guess Crean was hedging his bets and leaving the door cracked just a little, in the rare chance that some of his players decided to leave early, which many people were speculating would happen. Maybe, with Roth, Crean should have been cruel to be kind.

And Patterson’s failure to meet IU’s academic requirements was not Crean’s fault, at all. How can any sensible person blame Crean for an independent faculty board concluding that Patterson was not ready for the rigors of IU’s academic requirements? Crean gave Patterson an opportunity. It did not work out for this year. No harm, no foul, end of story.

 
#33
Harvard for Hillbillies
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 3:04 PM EDT

Hard to believe it was only 8 months ago that Matt Roth’s 22 points(5-of-6 three-pointers and a perfect 7-of-7 at the free throw line) played a momentous role in propelling the Hoosiers to their first Big 10 road win in two years.

I remember that there still was a lot of doubt concerning the Hoosiers truly being back(despite the win at home against UK). In retrospect, I wonder if some of the old doubt creeps back in without the win against Penn State in Happy Valley. Following the win, the success was fading quickly with a home stumble against Minnesota, a pretty thorough beating at OSU, and a shocking loss against lowly Nebraska. Within that very ugly stretch, the Hoosiers still had the one Big 10 road win under their belt hanging around in the rear view mirror, the monkey of the back, to hold onto with a sincere optimism in their hearts that an early season win at NC State and a buzzer-beater against UK would not be the only defining moments their season.

Matt Roth meant much more to our success last year than he’ll likely ever know. It’s not always about season totals in the final statistics..It’s about coming up big when you’re given your chance. It’s about stepping in unselfishly when others have fallen in the cause. It’s about believing in yourself because you believe in the team and the brothers you are committed to on the floor. Matt delivered flawlessly in all areas at being a Hoosier. The 3-pointers, the gumption to launch bombs when your rusty elbow has been waiting its opportunity in the wings, was nothing but frosting the on the cake in our typical shallow understanding of the complexities a true-blooded Hoosier. Roth believed in the solid handshake, the hours of work where love of a sport holds to faith where God-given ability is on the short end of the stick, and the unstated honor of good intentions that need no words of reciprocity from those you trust. The game of basketball and its disappearing soul suffers when kids like Matt Roth walk from her hardwood disenfranchised. Easy to lose sight of what is represented in those five banners hanging above McCracken when our long hunger for the cloth now magnified in its reality reduces a Hoosier into a trite phrase now an “option.” When Matt Roth came into the game flying Cream and Crimson above his long-range cannon, it was not an “option” for the opposing team to poorly defend him with the same indifference we now casually apply to our cause his worth.

Clarence(George Bailey’s guardian angel) said it best in Frank Capra’s It’s a Wonderful Life

“Strange, isn’t it? Each man’s life touches so many other lives. When he isn’t around he leaves an awful hole, doesn’t he?”

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NWqP3PpUdA4&feature=relmfu

 
#34
Dust in the wind
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 4:37 PM EDT

Tom Crean is an incompetent fool.

 
#35
Chet
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 4:52 PM EDT

I’m fascinated that there are people who somehow read “keep your options open” as “sit by the phone and wait and see how the team takes form, then I’ll try to figure out a way you can play here”.

Is that how you would handle your job if your company was bought out?

When someone says “keep your options open” it means “explore your options”. In Matt’s case it obviously means “if you’re planning on playing basketball next year you’d better explore your options because it very well might not happen here”.

How on Earth does anyone read that and think it meant anything else? You’re reading something that is not there.

 
#36
boilerdowd
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 5:46 PM EDT

Milla- So a Final Four is a foregone conclusion? Let me be the first to say congratulations on that and your ability to see into the future.

It’s funny- Hummel, Moore and Johnson didn’t accomplish anything, according to you. But, the Sweet 16 that IU earned this year got a trophy case in Ass. Hall. Odd for nothing to get such an honor. Two B1G titles and two sweet 16s is nothing indeed. Thanks for clearing it up for me.

 
#37
Dust in the wind
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 5:50 PM EDT

Tom Crean remains an incompetent fool.

 
#38
Harvard for Hillbillies
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 6:29 PM EDT

Chet-

If somehow that last scholarship would have opened up in the last weeks of summer(possibly Creek cannot return?)and Roth had already decided that his best option was to sign with a nearby rival, I seriously doubt most fans would not consider him a backstabbing traitor to Indiana.

The only thing Crean was keeping “open” was his mouth and the “option” was a needed deception communicated to Roth to cover his own ass in the event he needed his services. Matt should have been clearly told at the conclusion of the season that nothing was still potentially on the table and that his days at IU were over.

Maybe Matt was naive for believing he meant more to his coach than a fall plan. It could easily be hypothesized that Crean had knowledge of anticipated academic issues with one of his commits and that he wasn’t wholly convinced Creek would be able to give it a go. Tough. Hard decisions need to be made and the consequences fall as they may. There was no reason for Crean to keep the door even the slightest bit cracked on Roth’s return other than self-interest(knowing two scholarships could open up) superseding the best “option” to tell Matt Roth in all certainty his days wearing candy stripes was over.

It’s truly ridiculous this is even being discussed in late August and only exemplifies ineptness in communication, lack of forthrightness, and disregard a truth that was left purposefully shrouded in deceit by men that should have higher regard a faithful and good-hearted young man.

 
#39
Podunker
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 7:01 PM EDT

“There was no reason for Crean to keep the door even the slightest bit cracked on Roth’s return other than self-interest (knowing two scholarships could open up) superseding the best “option” to tell Matt Roth in all certainty his days wearing candy stripes was over.”

Harvard, if you possess the slightest amount of objectivity about this issue, you must admit that hind-site is 20/20 and that, last spring, Crean was not able to predict what would transpire between April and August 20th. If Crean had lost two players, for whatever reason, any combination of NBA draft, transfer, flunk out, career ending injury, I’m sure Roth would be getting his fifth year of scholarship right now.

Of course it was self-interest. Crean’s professional obligation, and what the vast majority of the Hoosier Nation demands he do, is to produce the best, most competitive basketball team he possibly can, and win as many games as he can, while working within the rules of the NCAA, the Big Ten and the policies of Indiana University. That’s what he is paid to do.

 
#40
Geoff
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 8:08 PM EDT

Once again, Po and Chet are 100% on point.

Tsao – I really liked post #20…not that you care. But I would also like to hear Crean address this publicly within the context of his values.

 
#41
Dust in the wind
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 8:15 PM EDT

. Crean’s professional obligation, and what the vast majority of the Hoosier Nation demands he do, is to produce the best, most competitive basketball team he possibly can [...]

Roth was by far not the weakest player on scholarship therefore by ruling him out Crean isn’t producing the best, most competitive basketball team he possibly can — which is his professional obligation. So, as a result, he should be fired.

 
#42
L'Accent
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 9:08 PM EDT

The person who signs Podumpster continues to “reason” exclusively with his derrière in all his posts.

Feb 2, 2009:

Indiana freshman guard Matt Roth tied a Big Ten-game and IU mark by connecting on nine three-pointers against the Buckeyes for a career-high 29 points on Saturday.

Since Tom Crean has better players I expect one of them this season to surpass Matt’s freshman record. If not, by Podumpster’s rule Tom Crean should be fired.

April 2012:

Matt Roth led the Big Ten in shooting from the 3-point line at 54.5 percent on the year and 59.2 percent in league contests during his senior campaign. His 3-point percentage was the second-best ever at Indiana and his league percentage set a new IU record. Roth is tied for 10th all-time in career 3-point field goal percentage (41.4 percent) at Indiana.

But Crean has better players says Podumpster. I want to read their names at the end of the season in a paragraph like Matt Roth’s above. If not, Crean is a failure and should be fired.

Matt Roth is an elite player. Unfortunately at Indiana he he doesn’t have an elite coach.

 
#43
Harvard for Hillbillies
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 9:12 PM EDT

I’m pretty sure it was determined fairly early that Cody and Watford were not going Pro. I highly doubt Crean was in the dark about their intentions a few weeks after the season’s conclusion. I would also surmise he was kept abreast of his players academic standings. Isn’t this the same coach that told the nation Sampson’s thugs were carrying around 19 combined ‘F’s'?

The only time Crean has had a transfer(Story, Williams, and Capobianco are the three off the top my head)was to make room for an incoming oversign or an incoming transfer that was the son of an NBA coach/friend. You guys really need to start being honest here. Most kids that would sign with Indiana when the program is in the early phases of attempting to regain relevancy would be strongly committed to the school. Crean labeled these young men as part of a “New Generation”…He talked of these early recruiting classes as some of the most honorable Hoosiers to have ever donned the colors. It was if they fell out of heaven to guide us from ruin to resurrection. These men were slaughtered and embarrassed as sacrifice the cheats that came before them but yet believed in the eternal light of glory their coach had told us was never removed from their hearts and determined souls. Undaunted Christian soldiers as they marched undaunted into battles far outmatched. Did they ever degrade our name or give up when scores were insurmountable?

I find it highly symbolic that Roth, one of the final Sampson recruits not part of the labeling a degenerate crowd, was not given every opportunity to wear the uniform to its fullest. These men that kept true to Indiana amidst those that were degrading her name epitomized every speech Crean made in reference to an altruistic meaning of “Because it’s Indiana.” For being such a treasured breed of a one-of-a-kind proud Hoosiers, Roth sure gave him an old taste in his mouth.

Roth deserved much more than the silent treatment of cold indifference. He deserved true appreciation for the way he represented Indiana in her darkest hour.

If you can’t see the hypocrisy enveloping the treatment of Roth so blatantly obvious within the backdrop of every Crean tweet and podium sermon the deeper truths far more important than winning and losing(faith, decency, honor, God, honesty, work ethic, brotherhood), then you, my friend, are sinking in the Polyanna quicksand of a carnival salesman made you blind by way his slippery tongue.

 
#44
Geoff
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 9:13 PM EDT

Dust in the wind – here we go again… Whether or not Roth was the weakest player on scholarship isn’t the point. Roth was not going to be a relevant player on this team. Crean will be putting the best team out on the floor whether Roth was participating in practice or not. Since Roth wasn’t going to be a contributor on this years team, Crean, who’s obligation is also to build a team that STAYS successful, should keep and develop the younger players.

That is his professional obligation. Therefore, he should not be fired.

 
#45
Dust in the wind
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 9:24 PM EDT

Oh, yea, Geoff, Roth is not Verdell that’s all there is.

 
#46
Geoff
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 9:43 PM EDT

That doesn’t make any sense…

If you are saying that Roth is better than VJ3 (???), then I agree. I thought VJ3 should have spent a lot more time on the pine. If he were eligible this year I’d be BS if he got any pt…

If your are saying that Roth isn’t even as good as Jones, ok… If that’s the case, there’s no way that Roth should play.

 
#47
L'Accent
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 9:46 PM EDT

The only time Crean put the best team on the floor last year was when the injuries did it for him.

 
#48
Harvard for Hillbillies
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 9:48 PM EDT

Verdell was never removed from the “chosen one” nipple…I believe Geoff even once wrote how much he “SUCKS!”. Was it Crean’s “professional obligation” to play him when all so unattached the romance could easily see the dysfunctional result of not putting the best on the floor in favor of such uncomfortable public devotion?

Roth, on the other hand, was not fed upon the same dutiful nipple of professionalism granted VJ. He was left in the crib unattended. He was extended the same final destination of where Crean’s love is given to the Charmin of Mr. Whipple.

 
#49
Podunker
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 9:48 PM EDT

Harvard, if Crean had kept Story, Williams, and Capobianco, IU would not have gotten to the sweet 16 last year and would not be ranked in the top five for the coming season. Last season would not have been as “magical” as it was and the future of IU basketball would not be as bright as it is.

And why do you assume a player would rather sit on the bench at IU as compared to playing significant time for another college team. Often times, transferring is in the player’s best interests. It’s often a win-win scenario. Why assume the worst?

You act as if Crean is the first coach in college basketball that has encouraged players to leave a college program. Knight did this on a regular basis, Wilson ran about 20 guys off the team in the last year, and my guess is any major college coach with more than four years of head coaching experience has done it numerous times.

And Harvard, why do you insist on bringing up Crean’s Christian faith? Why is that relevant to the Roth case? How did Crean behave in an “un-Christian” manner? Please, let’s leave religion and the man’s faith out of the debate. This is a sports blog, and it’s not the forum to be debating religion or denigrating someone’s faith.

 
#50
Geoff
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 9:48 PM EDT

If you’re not saying anything about his talent level relevant to Verdell then your comment had no relevance to the conversation.

 
#51
Podunker
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 9:54 PM EDT

L’Accent, your post #42 was weak. But congratulations for bringing a new level of inanity to this debate.

Math Roth is an elite player? Come on. He was a good college player, and a great outside shooter, but no serious college basketball fan would ever rate him as an elite player, by anyone’s definition of elite. If Roth is an elite player, why was he not drafted by the NBA or picked up by one of the European pro teams? Is he one of the 20 best IU players of all time? No, Roth was a good player and a great outside shooter, but not an elite player.

I don’t want to write anything that would appear to be disrespectful about Matt Roth, because I too was a big fan of his and I really appreciate and respect the young man’s accomplishments. But my regard for the young man does not deprive me of logic and ability to think rationally.

By the way, it’s not my opinion that counts. Crean thinks he has better players and his opinion is the only one that counts. But you just keep tilting at those windmills while Crean leads IU to the final four and continues to rebuild IU basketball to national prominence. You’ll be like the guy sitting in the last row of the outfield bleachers yelling at the umpire and trying to convince him that the catcher missed the tag at home plate.

 
#52
Dust in the wind
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 10:02 PM EDT

I am saying that Crean’s ability to use Roth for four years was almost inexistent due to Crean’s incompetence as a coach. Crean is a really bad coach. He got here simply by happenstance: there was a vacancy and he was selected by the great Rick Greenspan (Greenspan’s last great move before he left IU in disgrace) fill the power vacuum. Crean is a walk-on coach. The essence of his coaching is: (a) tweeting and (b) clapping.

I am saying that Roth deserved more during the previous four years and even with Crean using him only as a last resort he set Big Ten records both as a freshman and as a senior. Someone said on here that if Verdell had been in the same situation “Crean would have kindly shoved Jesus off the team.” It is exactly the truth.

 
#53
L'Accent
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 10:10 PM EDT

By the way, it’s not my opinion that counts.

I am glad you finally realized that. Fleeting moments of lucidity — you should hang on to those.

 
#54
Harvard for Hillbillies
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 10:19 PM EDT

Podunker-

If Crean prefers to put his religious leanings in front of the tweeting masses while juxtaposed with the name and images of “Indiana Basketball” in full public view, then I have every right in discussing my personal opinion his reasons for doing so. Crean denigrates himself by propping up his name alongside the man he views as eternal savior. He cheapens faith and brings Indiana basketball discussions into his tidal wave of Christian devotion. It is his choice to differentiate a particular faith and paint the image of Jesus as relevant to marketing Indiana. I’ll let you decide how that bestows a level of sincerity upon the quieter virtues and beliefs held by Matt Roth or any other individual that may believe the haven of a respected faith be stronger than quotes and words on a private internet billboard whoring the name of our institution for the furtherance one’s own pious image.

 
#55
Geoff
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 10:32 PM EDT

I’m still not sure why it’s struck such a nerve with you Harvard. Most IU fans aren’t aware or care about his religious leanings. They are fans because they went to IU or are from the state or have some connection to the school. I’d say about 1% or less are fans of IU basketball BECAUSE of TC. It really doesn’t matter what he says or does as long as he doesn’t break rules, his players are students while they are enrolled, and he wins.

Until you can prove that his religious statements or views have somehow negatively impacted his ability to do his job, then… Who cares… You’re grasping at straws because of your own stringent views.

 
#56
Chet
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 10:32 PM EDT

Harvard, et al, why do you guys keep insinuating that Matt Roth is an idiot? You guys make him sound like a clueless feeb. How did a guy so out of touch pick up two degrees, including a graduate degree, and not have any idea what was going on around him. Harvard, you know I like you and enjoy your posts but you make Matt sound like he’s a four-year-old.

Dust in the wind, you win the ‘Stupid Post of 2012 Award’. Seriously, Dude. That’s just dumb.

 
#57 Monday, August 27, 2012 - 10:35 PM EDT

Everyone read this: http://indiana.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=1401618

I’m pretty sure Roth is frustrated with Dustin and the commenters here.

 
#58
Chet
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 10:37 PM EDT

As I’ve said countless times, I’m not into religion. That being said, the coaching fraternity certainly is (or, they claim to be). To be, perhaps, cynical, it’s a recruiting tool for the Mom’s. If you want to denigrate a coach for expressing his religion you better plan on excluding 99% of all coaches.

 
#59
Chet
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 10:38 PM EDT

Thanks, Aruss. That’s what I assumed the entire time.

 
#60
Chet
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 10:48 PM EDT

I’m sure all those who have been blasting CTC will now step forward, hat in hand, and admit they were wrong.

Right?

Because, otherwise, they’d look pretty…well, you know.

I’m sure Debbie and Dust in the wind will be the first two to prove they have integrity.

 
#61
Keith
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 10:51 PM EDT

Well said Podunker!

 
#62
Harvard for Hillbillies
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 10:54 PM EDT

Chet-

I think Matt was naive. I don’t see that as a fault his intelligence as much his heart.

Most IU fans aren’t aware or care about his religious leanings.

I wonder if Dustin would find agreement with that statement. I wonder if every journalist in town believes his recruiting isn’t influenced by his religious leanings…? If he recruits based on those leanings, wouldn’t most fans be aware of the narrowing down of choices to wear our uniform based on a doctrine of faith?

Geoff- I hope Crean reads this blog and takes your words of advice by removing the name of Indiana from his Jesus preaching page devoted to Joyce Meyer, a tiny blue cartoon bird, and all basketball virgins he cares “a whole lot” about. He obviously believes it’s quite important. I would love nothing more than to see all personal religious viewpoints left out of basketball discussions. It is Crean that markets the cross with the hardwood and the hoop. It’s really quite the slap in the face to Wilson. Crean assumes Jesus isn’t as equally consumed with resurrecting Hoosier football?

 
#63
Chet
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 10:57 PM EDT

So, after reading that article, what do you have to say?

 
#64
Keith
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 10:58 PM EDT

Well said Podunker!  

 
#65
Harvard for Hillbillies
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 11:13 PM EDT

I’d say I was right. Matt is pretty damn naive and fed Peegs what they wanted to print. Would you expect anything else from a kid that’s a class act and a Bible thumper?

Doesn’t change how I feel. Other coaches working for public institutions.do not use a twitter page to sell their excessively pious personal doctrines of faith alongside the sports programs they represent. I don’t care what they sell to mother’s of recruits in living rooms. He cheapens my school with such shallowness in the marketing a game with the Bible. Can’t basketball be my simple realm of sinful enjoyment without the heaviness of where my eternal soul shall have final rest. Will I go to hell because I just don’t think its necessary to place the burden of such decisions on our maker because I don’t think of Jesus when Hoosiers take to the floor?

 
#66
Harvard for Hillbillies
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 11:17 PM EDT

….I just don’t think it’s necessary

 
#67
Harvard for Hillbillies
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 11:24 PM EDT

And shame on Dustin for deceiving us the truth of all the thorough communication that was going on between Roth and Crean. And people wonder why I believe in things like “Eastern Establishments” and conspiracies to suppress Indiana’s pathway back to basketball prominence?

It does certainly seem that even in our own backyard trouble is being stirred, public opinion is being deceptively manipulated, when nothing unethical exists.

 
#68
Dust in the wind
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 11:37 PM EDT

Chester,

That’s a lot of BS. What that article shows is simply that Matt Roth is a class act — elite in all respects, as has been said… Unlike, by comparison, Tom Crean: show me one single tweet from Crean that is “effusive in public praise” of Matt Roth.

 
#69
Keith
Monday, August 27, 2012 - 11:39 PM EDT

Podunker, I love you!

 
#70 Monday, August 27, 2012 - 11:59 PM EDT

So naturally, my head is spinning a little bit. I went back to read all three stories I wrote about Roth to try to figure out what could have been misconstrued. He suggests in the story that he had been in contact with Crean throughout the summer. However, that doesn’t go against anything I already reported. This was from the blog shortly after the Patterson situation:

Roth said he has been in contact with Indiana coach Tom Crean over the summer through text messaging and that he also worked at one of Crean’s summer camps, but that the two have not discussed his status in some time.

“He told me earlier in the summer to keep my options open,” Roth said. “I told him I wasn’t going to put a blindfold on and not look at jobs, not prepare. We both agreed do what’s best for me. Since then it’s just been checking in and seeing how thing are going. There’s been nothing very directly related to the situation. Everybody wants to figure out the final conclusion. We’ve talked back and forth. Hopefully we’re either going to get together or have a final phone call. It’s a business and I’m aware of everything involved.”

I’ve asked Roth repeatedly and he’s told me repeatedly that he hasn’t been told anything definitive. I asked him Sunday that same question, and he told me again that he’d heard nothing definitive. There was something in the Peegs.com story about me asking about a specific situation. That’s correct, but I also wrote in the story about said specific situation. I asked him specifically if they had talked at camp. He said they had not. And that’s how I printed it. I can’t say how often he had updates early in the summer, but I didn’t print that. I asked him each time if he had definitive word on his status from Crean and he told me each time that he did not. He said in the Peegs story that Crean did a good job of keeping him in the loop. I won’t dispute that if that’s what he said, but as of about four days before the start of class, he hadn’t totally given up hope of playing and he hadn’t been told that there was no spot for him. And a week into school no one told him that either.
I never said Roth was mad or angry at Crean. I even quoted him as saying “there’s no hard feelings either way.” All I did was write what he told me. I’ve placed a call to Matt to ask specifically what he believes what is inaccurate about my reporting and I have not yet heard back.

 
#71
TsaoTsuG
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 12:50 AM EDT

I just read Jeff Rabjohns piece in Peegs, a publication I previously rarely read but should do so more frequently.

As Chet suggests, given Matt Roth’s statements in some detail over the circumstances and Crean’s actions, I stand hat in hand, take ownership and regret misinformed criticisms. My hopes have always been for a successful and exemplary athletic program at IU. Rabjohns interview and Roth’s comments make it clear that those goals were sustained in the handling of Matt Roth’s 201-2013 participation.

As much as the movie “Hoosiers” portrays the soul of a state that expresses its decency in its playing and passion for the game of basketball in high school; the sharing of the name “Hoosiers” is not co-incidental, the same decency is hopefully shared by the Hoosiers that represent Indiana University. That hope and vision sometimes (as in this case) overflows reasonable limits. I regret it.

If there is consolation, it is as J. Rabjohns documents so well in his piece, that the Hoosiers continue to be who we hoped we were.

Apologies are due for the over-zealousness. And my hopes that my fellow IU alum and graduate Matt Roth will achieve his hopes (along with his now and future family) and enjoy the good that comes from being a Hoosier. It’s Indiana!

 
#72 Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 1:55 AM EDT

Dustin – you let these idiots who write their long winded comments insulting CTC on here influence your reporting. If these guys tried writing their garbage on my site, I’d have blacklisted them long ago. In your attempt to show these jackals you’re “fair & balanced”, you screw the pooch.

Lesson: ignore the trolls of this blog.

 
#73
Estes72
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 2:42 AM EDT

I read over and over again on site like this about how Crean is doing things, “the right way” and how Calipari is slime.. At least Calipari doesn’t throw his own players under the bus just to free up scholarships.. See ya buddy, I’ll give you a good reference. Jon Hood is a senior this year, but will have an additional year of eligibility due to his injury last year.. Jon is a good guy and a good player, but he’s not going to be a NBA draft pick by anyone’s standards.. Knowing this, I have no doubt though that he will still be a Wildcat next year with a scholarship.. See, as much as all the IU fans want to talk trash about Cal, he’s a players first coach. Just watch his post game speech to the team following the championship game. His players love him, because he puts them first. That goes from the starting 5 to the last man on the bench.. It’s no wonder the best of the best want to play for him.. Everyone likes to accuse him of cheating, but let’s be realistic here.. Why wouldn’t a 5 star player not want to play for a coach like Cal, and furthermore, why would a player want to play for a coach like Creen, who might throw away his scholarship if he needed somebody better.. Sick of hearing about IU’s ethics when they’ve just got off probation and continue to do unethical things in regard to their own player.

 
#74
Estes72
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 2:43 AM EDT

I read over and over again on site like this about how Crean is doing things, “the right way” and how Calipari is slime.. At least Calipari doesn’t throw his own players under the bus just to free up scholarships.. See ya buddy, I’ll give you a good reference. Jon Hood is a senior this year, but will have an additional year of eligibility due to his injury last year.. Jon is a good guy and a good player, but he’s not going to be a NBA draft pick by anyone’s standards.. Knowing this, I have no doubt though that he will still be a Wildcat next year with a scholarship.. See, as much as all the IU fans want to talk trash about Cal, he’s a players first coach. Just watch his post game speech to the team following the championship game. His players love him, because he puts them first. That goes from the starting 5 to the last man on the bench.. It’s no wonder the best of the best want to play for him.. Everyone likes to accuse him of cheating, but let’s be realistic here.. Why wouldn’t a 5 star player not want to play for a coach like Cal, and furthermore, why would a player want to play for a coach like Creen, who might throw away his scholarship if he needed somebody better.. Sick of hearing about IU’s ethics when they’ve just got off probation and continue to do unethical things in regard to their own players.

 
#75
Harvard for Hillbillies
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 4:43 AM EDT

Dustin-

Don’t let it get you down.

There was nothing you did wrong in your reporting. It now appears to me that Roth was playing people in a desperate attempt to manipulate his way back onto the team. In his heart of hearts, he must have known all along that his coach was not interested. People do foolish things when in search of compassion and love from those incapable to reciprocate. I can forgive Matt Roth for painting a situation differently to you because he was left searching in the cold reality of words spoken into his ears absent any true emotion and sincere regard. The world is harsh and principles mean little in the quest of prizes bigger than honor. That will be the humble lesson Matt will have learned from all of this.

 
#76
Harvard for Hillbillies
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 4:54 AM EDT

Goodbye Matt. Goodbye Indiana.

 
#77
Geoff
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 8:16 AM EDT

Harvard – most people don’t pay attention to tweets and aren’t on twitter. I’m not sure that most fans pay that close attention to the recruiting trail. Clearly the people who frequent IU blogs are a different animal, but even a lot of us would be oblivious to his religiosity if it weren’t for you posting about it all the time.

Whether he recruits with a bias is entirely debatable on its own, but beyond that, if he has only recruited and accepted commitments from Good Christians show me how that has hurt our program. He has put the program back on the map, as you so often remind us, with those players. And the recruiting of very good talent doesn’t seem to be an issue.

Again, you cannot show how Crean espousing his views to the small group of fans that…
A) elect to follow him on twitter
B) allow themselves to be marketed to
…has negatively effected his ability to do his job.

 
#78
Harvard for Hillbillies
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 8:28 AM EDT

Dustin-

Am I a jackal? Please don’t shackle the jackal. Is Podunker a jackal for being at odds with some of CKW’s methods? Are his long-winded comments influencing your reporting of the Hoosier football team?

Is the jackal representative of the anti-Christ now the anti-Hoosier? What a wonderful wall Crean has built around his sanctimonious fortress. Are you beginning to take notice how it works? If there is a jackal amongst us in Bloomington, could it have arrived in our darkest hour to seize upon the weak and fearful? Could it come with symbols and a glistening beautiful cross to hide its fangs? Could it invade our heart with the thick praising tongue of Lucifer disguised in the admiration our humble home? Would it have paraded through our streets and held before our eyes the evils of some of God’s misguided children it had no room for Christ or compromise? Would it teach us to despise the unique beauty in our differences and our beliefs and create distrust anything but the perfection its own reflection? Yes, there is a very real possibility a jackal is in town. Could it use the word of the Lord for mask its rabid nature? Does it feed on the flesh of innocence and decency untainted by the greed that basks in the fraudulent kingdom of lost souls that sell a self-serving faith where none truly exists? Be careful who you blacklist for the jackal has many friends that carry around its bag of bones to beat suppression and fear upon those that stand firm.

 
#79
Geoff
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 8:35 AM EDT

Dustin, I know it’s your career, but really this ain’t a big deal. You didn’t screw the pooch. The only contradiction in facts seems to be in Matt Roth’s head. You reported what he told you, and it isn’t much different than what he told Rabjohns. Either he didn’t read the piece you wrote and is going off rumor or biased perception of a confidant, or he didn’t read it closely enough to understand its essence. Either way, shame on him.

That being said, I wish Matt the best. I loved watching him play. Not only is he a Hoosier, but I’m sure he’s a great guy.

 
#80
Geoff
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 8:37 AM EDT

Honestly Harvard… What the hell are you talking about?

 
#81
Hoosier Clarion
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 8:45 AM EDT

I repeat, MR knew what the future could bring. Why else would he decide to participate in Senior night?

I also heard that at the Ft. Wayne golf outing insinuations were hinted Creek may never be the same and for certain not this season. All I have to say about that is if disloyalty and dishonesty are traits of Coach Crean that allow him to throw MR under the bus then loyalty and honor allowed him to keep Mo on the team. Make your choice.

 
#82
Harvard for Hillbillies
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 8:52 AM EDT

Geoff-

If nobody pays attention to Twitter, why does the story of his accidental tweet to a supposed recruit(“I think of you a whole lot”)make all the major internet sports pages? Is it simply the “Eastern Establishment” digging into the irrelevant world of Twitter because they simply want to mock the hicks of Indiana?

Crean has also gone beyond Twitter to bask himself publicly in the glory his own beliefs. Many took offense to his comments after the VCU game. I would argue that most detached outside observers that witnessed the postgame interview were just as taken aback as the reporter holding the microphone(her facial expression communicating the inappropriateness of a proclamation of God influencing our team’s success). This is only the beginning, my friend of the Northeast. There is an agenda and you just want to deny it. I don’t think Indiana needs Christ to be relevant.

 
#83
palos6637
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 9:00 AM EDT

Fact or Fiction

Dustin: When you write an aritcle that blatantly misrepresents a story to the extent that the subject is willing to do a follow up article with Rabjons we can only assume you have an agenda or a Journalism degree from Purdue and you could not help knowing how poorly you represnted the situation.

 
#84
Geoff
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 9:10 AM EDT

Harvard, IU doesn’t need Christ. You are right about that. We need talent and chemistry.

I didn’t say “no one” pays attention to twitter. The reason that was made a big deal is because a reporter made it into a news piece. If the tweet were left to twitter instead of the rest of the media it would have gone flat. But to further prove my point. I am 100% sure that if you asked any of my parents about the Crean recruiting tweet they would look at me with a blank stare.

Yes, Harvard, I’m in Digital Marketing. As I’ve mentioned before I work with many high-profile social media management companies. The stats and the experts I talk to both say that most people don’t pay attention to twitter.

Athletes and coaches give praise to God all the time. Crean wasn’t the first and won’t be the last. I’m sure that as inappropriate or uncomfortable as the comment was at the time it was fast forgotten by most viewers… Cast into the sea of other cliche and forgettable quotes they hear from sports personalities on a daily basis.

 
#85
Hoosier Clarion
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 9:13 AM EDT

HfH, I ditto Geoff’s remark, “what the hell are you talking about”.

 
#86
Harvard for Hillbillies
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 9:33 AM EDT

Let me rephrase that last sentence…

I don’t think Indiana needs the selling of Christ to be a relevant institution. I also don’t believe it to be appropriate to take a specific religion outside of a personal realm and place it beside the name of our public institution(whether it be on Twitter or a Christmas card sent to Geoff). As I’ve repeatedly said many times, I think it cheapens faith and moves perceptions of Indiana University into a backwardness rooted in narrowness and intolerance not indicative of what I want my school to represent. There is a difference in the freedom to believe as you choose and throwing it to the wind occasionally and using a job as a platform to abuse such freedom to cast supremacy your personal point of view. The furtherance of inclusiveness is what I want from ‘my’ Indiana.

Crean went beyond “thanking God” in his postgame remarks after the VCU win. I found it just as offensive as if he were claiming the Devil was cheering for VCU. I only hope most viewers had tuned out by that time. I find the placement of the name my alma mater within the constant crap pile of Joyce Meyer tweets as highly offensive.

 
#87
Harvard for Hillbillies
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 9:44 AM EDT

Geoff-

Can I agree with you on something?

Dustin, I know it’s your career, but really this ain’t a big deal. You didn’t screw the pooch. The only contradiction in facts seems to be in Matt Roth’s head. You reported what he told you, and it isn’t much different than what he told Rabjohns. Either he didn’t read the piece you wrote and is going off rumor or biased perception of a confidant, or he didn’t read it closely enough to understand its essence. Either way, shame on him.

That being said, I wish Matt the best. I loved watching him play. Not only is he a Hoosier, but I’m sure he’s a great guy.

I agree with every word that post. Dustin is the last person that should be our next popular crucifixion. Dustin- May I suggest you just put out a story about Bob Knight as a diversionary tactic and the spikes will soon find different wrists in the Land of the Holier-than-Thous.

 
#88
Chet
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 9:56 AM EDT

Estes72, UK is a bait and tackle shop. Most of your ex-players are broke and have no education unless they are lucky enough to make it in the NBA. Then they are just broke and uneducated a few years later. IU grads practically run the NBA. UK, well grads isn’t the right word, former players are just fodder for sad stories.

Harvard…Harvard, Harvard, Harvard. Only ONE person can fully detail the dealings Matt Roth has had with CTC and that person is Matt Roth. YET, despite his saying he was in the loop and everything was above board you insist he is naive and doesn’t actually know what was happening in his own life nearly as well as you do.

Own up, man. Because of your personal animosity towards CTC you are trying to claim that only you know the TRUE story and Matt is a clueless feeb. This has become the theater of the absurd. Does Matt have to address you personally and say, “Oh, by the way, Harvard, you were way off base”?

It isn’t so much of what Dustin wrote as much as how you took what he wrote and used it to match the narrative in your mind. You wrote the whole story out a long time ago.

As Geoff put it so well, most people don’t follow tweets. Do you know where I hear 100% of CTC comments about religion? From YOUR postings. Nowhere else. You want to quiet the spread of his comments? Quit re-posting them.

It has become glaringly obvious that this is not about CTC and his actual actions as a basketball coach, it’s about your opinion of CTC’s personal beliefs. That is not cool.

To Dust in the mind, ‘show [me] some tweets’? Seriously? I can’t imagine my time being of so little value that I would ever waste it to follow anyone on Twitter. It’s all I can do to check my email a couple times a day.

 
#89
Harvard for Hillbillies
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 10:12 AM EDT

The reason that was made a big deal is because a reporter made it into a news piece

Isn’t that true of nearly every story? It’s rarely news without someone creating it as such. It’s constantly crafted and fed within varying scales of honesty or purposeful construction of narrow bias excluding relevant facts. I don’t order the news off a menu. News is cooked and we are nothing but boob-tube watching prisoners in waiting with our tin plates hungry a full helping their sensationalized concocted grub. Rarely do we question the bias behind the choices of what makes news news. What makes Twitter any more irrelevant than anything plucked from the ambiguous haystacks of all information filtered to the masses by those in charge its distribution? If it extends free thought and free speech then maybe it can serve as reducing the powers of those that would just as happily monopolize exchange of information. I don’t necessarily define the exploding means of communication as “garbage” because its out of the controls of mega corporations and boardrooms.

 
#90
Harvard for Hillbillies
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 10:50 AM EDT

Chet-

It’s difficult to fully trust without being a little naive. I don’t consider it a flaw in character. The flaw is in the abuse of those that so fear being a little blind and thus live to disregard the preciousness of the assumed good intentions a decent man. We were oversigned by two scholarships. How can it be construed as anything but a bit naive for Matt to think his coach was sincere in offering any option to continue at Indiana? It’s not Harvard that invented those words that kept him dangling on a hook like a baby bluegill sucking up a fat worm.

 
#91
Ron (florida)
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 11:42 AM EDT

1…What Chet said.

2…A guess here. Dustin probably got the essence of Matt’s feelings. Maybe after the golf thing’ie CTC kinda reminded Matt of the contacts they had and mentioned he was getting a little flack and a little support would be helpful to both…? Who knows and who cares. Done deal and if CTC would try to please all the IU fans he would be a failure at his real job.

3) Dustin, you have a article yesterday, interview with Glass. Is that who you wanted to interview or who you ended up with?

 
#92
Lord of the What Harvard said
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 12:19 PM EDT

All is not lost when there is a scholarship crunch.

 
#93
Hoosier Clarion
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 12:36 PM EDT

Triple what Chet said, with this addition, HfH quit posting your bias about Coach Crean…I doubt he is affected…+ you are losing the argument…badly.

 
#94
Podunker
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 2:05 PM EDT

Tsao, your post #71 renews and increases my regard and respect for your character and integrity. You sir, demonstrated your integrity and honor, and I salute you for demonstrating that in your comments.

Chet, your post #88 was filled with pearls and simply brilliant. It was, perhaps, the best post written on this site in a long, long time. Brilliant.

HforH, there are so many things I’d like to say in response to just two of your posts on this string (I just could not read them all), but I’m afraid that you would think that I was being derogatory, insincere, or incendiary, so I will refrain. Certain things, when tone is important, should not be trusted to written communication, because they can so easily be misinterpreted. And honestly, some times you demonstrate a tendency to interpret things in the worst possible way. So I’ll just say this; I wish you well and I hope you find peace.

Let’s play football!

 
#95
Podunker
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 2:12 PM EDT

One more thing. Matt Roth is a most impressive MAN! This country needs a lot more young men like Matt Roth. After reading the article by Rabjohn, my regard for Matt Roth increased significantly. He will continue to be very successful in whatever he chooses to do.

 
#96
Mike P
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 2:43 PM EDT

Dustin,

I wouldn’t worry to much about it, you do a great job feeding the Hoosier faithful.

Aruss,

I………..nevermind. I got sick of the childish fighting on here by others so I’m going to keep my mouth shut, for now, and hope you self-impose another “ban” and slink back into the abyss from which you came.

 
#97
Geoff
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 2:53 PM EDT

Regarding #89…

Yes, that is how news works. My point is that there were 75,682 tweets that TC wrote before that very few of us ever were aware of. Just because that one tweet became news doesn’t mean it was big news. The vast majority of sports fans would have NO idea what you were talking about if you brought it up. The majority of college basketball fans wouldnt have a clue. Hell, even a large percentage of IU fans would be oblivious to that snippet of “news”.

So few people care…

You are like the right wing, fundamentalist republican screaming at the top of his lungs that we need to pass laws to prevent voter fraud when in reality there have only been like .01 proven cases per decade per state.

It’s a non-issue and so is Crean’s religion and tweeting…

 
#98
Harvard for Hillbillies
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 3:34 PM EDT

It’s all good. I have no problem standing alone. I have no problem trusting Dustin’s narrative over a mighty God that brought his final truth down from your mountain of Peegs.

As I said above, now that the door has finally closed, would we expect Roth to say anything differently than the brilliant script now our final synopsis of reference shown on Peegs?

I don’t believe Dustin tried to deceive anyone the last four months. I’m confident in my interpretation of where the real deception was rooted. Matt Roth made a choice to how he wanted this story to end. Maybe it’s as honorable as Tsao flip-flopping the same. He took one for the team and I guess that makes him live in a much better light for doing so. He did what was needed to preserve his love for Indiana.

But let’s please stop kidding ourselves from believing Matt always knew where his fantasy would end. There were always NO OPTIONS open to him…including a vindictive tongue at the finish line from a kid that was nothing but a decent young man that happened to me a rather one-dimensional dangerous perimeter shooter. If he held anything significantly more than that limited skill set, Creek would be the victim of this charade.

I won’t stop in my belief that Roth deserved more than the indifference given his dreams to fulfill his final eligible year at Indiana.

 
#99
Geoff
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 4:01 PM EDT

Right Harvard… We also believe that Matt deserved more than indifference. We just believe that he received more than indifference.

You’re not standing alone when it comes to siding with Dustin’s story. There are lots, and most likely the vast majority, that stand behind Dustin’s word. However, there is simply very little difference between what Peegs reported and what Dustin reported. Really the only difference seems to be how they are construed by the readers.

 
#100
TsaoTsuG
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 4:27 PM EDT

Sorry HfH…was with you right to the MR quotes. In fact, as I read the first three paragraphs in the Rabjohn piece I thought about my specific questions to Dustin (see #11, #18,#20 including DD’s answers) and felt very comfortable voicing a critical view. Then, the reference to the Peeg’s story- in particular MR’s quotes themselves. To defend the point further would have been ignoring the truth. The entire point just fell apart…there was no point other than ‘wanting to be right’ more ‘than being right’.

I admire your will to stand there as the incoming goes off, really do. We do need to continue to watch the offering of more scholarships than the number we have; next time it would involve and reflect on all of us as we should take note of consequences from this experience.

Nevertheless, we should always understand that each of us can be wrong on any one issue and, if we are sincere, suffer no loss from openly saying so amongst our friends.

 
#101
Harvard for Hillbillies
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 4:28 PM EDT

Peegs made an accusation within their reporting, Geoff. That’s a monumental difference for this reader. It was an attack on the credibility their intended target. It showed a total lack of class in painting a fair reporter as having an agenda in the matter.

It’s evident in Dustin’s atypical disjointed ramblings in post #70 that he was a bit shook up. I don’t blame him. I he passes the insinuating fool in a bar he should flatten his nose.

We blow a lot of accusatory wind on here(nature of the blogging beast, I guess), but I would expect there would be more expected decorum between fellow journalists covering the same team in the same town.

And simply because within this forum your opinion is more in line with the majority of six bloggers this very tiny subset(Hoosier Basketball) of a subset(college sports) of a subset(all sports) voicing on a subject very irrelevant to the average sports fan(Roth’s story likely followed on a national scene fewer than a weird Crean tweet) blah..blah…blah..bla-bla-bla-blah doesn’t necessarily mean a larger neutral audience given the same facts..blah..blah..blah..bla-bleep-bla-blah-blah-blah-blah…You get the point.

 
#102
Harvard for Hillbillies
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 4:51 PM EDT

I really have no redeeming qualities. Obnoxious stubborn lazy fool with habitual tendencies that have led to a very unproductive existence compiling failure after failure. I am all seven deadly sins wrapped into one pile of blubber a fat ass in a chair. I am heading for the end with nothing proud to look back upon…I am an open book that serves nothing other than putting my illiterate nature on full display. You guys have lived and thus pass the time to blog. I have passed the time to blog to avoid what I have lived. Too much a coward to change. Too much baggage in the head to rearrange.

 
#103 Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 6:00 PM EDT

Mike P – that was not cool.

 
#104
Keith
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 9:03 PM EDT

Yeah, I agree.

 
#105
Dust in the wind
Tuesday, August 28, 2012 - 9:25 PM EDT

^ Funny. Replace the caption with “If you want a scholarship from me then you have to …”, at least that’s how I read it.

 
#106
Hoosier Clarion
Wednesday, August 29, 2012 - 7:13 PM EDT

Mike P. in my way of thinking that was real cool.

 


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