Griffey’s last-second layup gives Illinois 74-72 win over No. 1 Indiana


WHAT HAPPENED: No. 1 Indiana blew a 10-point lead in the last 4:21 and Illinois senior forward Tyler Griffey scored a layup off an inbound play with 0.9 seconds to go to give the Fighting Illini a 74-72 win over the Hoosiers and inciting a court-storming on the Champaign, Ill., version of Assembly Hall.

Illinois outscored Indiana 15-3 in the last 4:21. The Hoosiers were still up 70-68 with three minutes to go, but Illinois senior guard D.J. Richardson hit back-to-back 3-pointers and then a step-back, fadeaway jumper to tie the game 70-70 with 1:19 to go. IU junior guard Victor Oladipo gave the Hoosiers the lead back with a driving layup with 50 seconds to go, but Illinois senior guard Brandon Paul tied it again with two free throws with 37.5 seconds left. IU tried to hold for the last shot and Oladipo started a drive for the win, but lost the ball on the way. He got back in transition and swatted an attempted layup from Richardson far out of bounds.

However, on the inbound play, the Fighting Illini set a screen beyond the 3-point line at the right elbow, senior forward Christian Watford switched onto the screener, but no one followed Griffey as he made a curl cut right at the basket. Paul found him right in front of he hoop for an easy layup just before the buzzer.

WHO MADE IT HAPPEN: Griffey’s game-winning layup was just part of an extremely strong night for the senior. He knocked down a pair of critical 3-pointers and finished with 14 points and eight rebounds.

Paul and Richardson, though, got the Illini back in the game. Richardson finished with 23 points, knocking down eight of 15 shots and four of eight 3-pointers, that included his personal 8-0 run to tie the game with 1:19 to go. Richardson also had three steals, and was a big part of the reason for Indiana’s 14 turnovers.

Paul also had a strong outing, scoring 21 points, making six of 14 field goals and three of seven 3-pointers. He also had three assists and two steals.

IU sophomore center Cody Zeller finished with 14 points, nine rebounds and two assists. He was 4-for-6 from the field. Junior swingman Will Sheehey scored 13 points, senior forward Christian Watford had 12 points and eight rebounds, but also had six turnovers. Senior guard Jordan Hulls had 11 points. Oladipo had nine points and five assists, though he shot just 3-for-7, and freshman forward Jeremy Hollowell hit a pair of 3-pointers, making 3′s for the first time since Dec. 1.

WHY DID IT HAPPEN: Indiana shot a better percentage from the field than Illinois, a better percentage from the 3-point arc, and a better percentage at the free throw line. The Hoosiers also won the rebounding battle. But they lost the game. The biggest reason was turnovers.

Indiana gave the ball away 14 times on Thursday, and Illinois capitalized an almost all of the opportunities that allowed. Illinois scored 28 points off turnovers, a season-high for an Indiana opponent, to the Hoosiers’ 16.

The Illini might have shot a lower percentage than the Hoosiers across the board, but because of those turnovers, Illinois had more attempts and as many makes. And Griffey’s layup gave them one more field goal than the Hoosiers. They were 26-for-58 from the field, 9-for-24 from beyond the 3-point arc and 13-for-15 for the line while Indiana was 25-for-50 from the field, 9-for-17 from beyond the arc and 13-for-14 at the line.

The 3-pointers got the Illini back in the game. Illinois stroked five in the second half including three in the last seven minutes that were critical to the comeback. IU coach Tom Crean said the problem was over-helping on drives and post-ups and leaving shooters in the corners where Indiana knew full well the Illini were dangerous. That allowed Illinois to get back in the game after it had been left for dead.

Also, Will Sheehey’s technical with 1:27 left in the first half, which led to four points for Illinois, didn’t help.

WHAT DOES IT MEAN: Obviously, it means that the Hoosiers become the fifth No. 1 team to fall in the last five weeks. How far they go down is tough to tell, considering that Florida and Kansas already lost this week.

The bigger implications of the loss are its effect on Indiana’s hopes for a Big Ten title. The Hoosiers came into the game alone atop the conference at 8-1. At 8-2, they are in a tie with Michigan and Michigan State atop the league and a game up on Ohio State and Wisconsin at 7-3. Indiana’s schedule is backloaded, and the Hoosiers still have to play at Ohio State, at Michigan State, at Minnesota and at Michigan. Losing to Illinois gives the Hoosiers a lot less margin for error in those games. It also means Indiana has to rebound quickly before going to Ohio State on Sunday.

WHO SAID WHAT:

Tom Crean

“We didn’t put them away. We had our opportunities. That’s really what the bottom line was. We broke some coverages. We let some old habits kick in where we over-helped rather than staying committed to the corners. That’s where they hit us. When you’re going against great talent, which this league is full of, you’ve gotta stay committed to it for 40 minutes. You’ve gotta keep your chest in front of the ball. You’ve gotta keep your communication high. You’ve gotta have that commitment to what makes you good, which for us is early help, early recovery, and understanding what their strengths are, which is their 3-point shooting.”

“The end of the game was a broken play for them. We were not gonna give them a chance to set up and win the game on a lob. They were out of timeouts, we had two. I wouldn’t change that for a second, looking back and calling a timeout there. We just didn’t communicate, didn’t communicate a switch there at the end. At the end of the game offensively, we didn’t stay with what we needed to have. We wanted to make it a one-possession game. We did not want to call a timeout, they’re very good on side out of bounds, defending that. We wanted to keep the game in movement, and if we didn’t get what we wanted, then we wanted something coming down the middle of the floor We went at the right time, but we didn’t keep the game in movement enough. That didn’t do it. They made some 3′s and they got momentum because we didn’t stay where we needed to defensively.”

“When we turn the ball over, we’re not very good. The biggest difference in this game tonight is 28 points off turnovers to our 16. … The turnovers we’re making, there’s no defense for that. Our guys were ready, they were prepared, they respect Illinois. There’s no doubt about that. There is no overlooking any of that. We just turned the ball over, we didn’t stay committed to what we wanted to do at the end of the game.”

Jordan Hulls

“We turned the ball over too much, didn’t hit open shots didn’t stick to the game plan.”

Cody Zeller

“It’s always frustrating losing in this league. It’s a tough way to lose anyway.”

“We’re not rotating far enough. It’s too much overhelp when it’s not needed. That’s a big reason they had open 3′s.”

Christian Watford

“It was me and Yogi. There was a mix-up. It was a busted play and they got a layup.”

“It’s a tough one. it’s definitely a tough pill to swallow. You just gotta learn from it. Losses like this, you can’t do nothing about it now. You just gotta go forward and learn from it, look at the film and see what we didn’t do right. But we know we let one get away from us.”

On Turnovers

“A lot of them were on us. Just careless with the basketball, not being locked in here and there. We’ll get it corrected.”

AUDIO: Tom Crean

AUDIO: John Groce, Tyler Griffey, Brandon Paul

AUDIO: Jordan Hulls

AUDIO: Cody Zeller

AUDIO: Christian Watford

Share the Scoop!

58 comments:

  • AWinAZ #1


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 2:03 AM EDT

    What kind of “swaheelie” is this!?!?!?

    “We wanted to keep the game in movement, and if we didn’t get what we wanted, then we wanted something coming down the middle of the floor We went at the right time, but we didn’t keep the game in movement enough. That didn’t do it.”

    No wonder there is a miscommunication on the last play….

  • hiensohn #2


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 3:09 AM EDT

    Was Crean even watching those last sequences?Why on earth was watford still in the game?He blew so many plays in the last 8 minutes,what was wrong with him,and were was our coach?Crean admitted he should have played hollowell more in some of the games last week.Why not the end of this game?watford looked out of sorts and out of gas,he blew 5 possessions in a row by my count.Gad,it looked like we had no coach at all.It is a disgrace to lose this game,unlike Wisconsin and Butler,Illinois didn’t even play well.

  • briansloanthemadscreener #3


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 6:41 AM EDT

    I seems to remember a coach years ago preaching “victory favors the team that makes the fewest mistakes”. Was that sign removed from the locker room when he left? Took my 16 yr old son to the other Assembly Hall, boy what a disappointment. This team is not particularly tough nor does it seem to have any leadership from Watford nor Hulls. I’m not anxiously awaiting March.

  • HoosiersFan61 #4


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 8:31 AM EDT

    I kinda had a feeling IU would play like that last night I mean we are now 1-10 inside Assembly Hall in Illinois. I can’t stand how a bunch of people are blaming Tom Crean, when clearly the players messed up on that inbound pass. This is a tough league to play in. The Illni had everything to play for last night, because it was there NCAA tournament game. I mean all week everyone was hating on Illinois and saying how they had no chance. I just hope IU uses this loss to get motivated for Sunday. If we go to OSU and beat them I better not hear any complaints from IU fans. I’m so tired of half of you complaining after every loss. We are still a great team, its just that we had an off night. Who every is saying we lost the Big Ten title is crazy. There is a ton of games left. I hope you fans remember that we used to be 6-25, so stop complaining after all of IU losses. This is a very touch conference. We are 4-1 on the road thats is very good. Lets Go HOOSIERS!!!!!

  • Terryz #5


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 9:52 AM EDT

    Maybe the team should remember we used to be 6-25. Where’s the fire? Victor is a 6 man, not a point. Where’s pride? Where’s defense?

  • Hoosier Clarion #6


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 10:18 AM EDT

    There has to be a herd of Holstein cattle close to Bloomington. CW needs to spend every early morn and every late afternoon at that farm milking “by hand” about 3 dozen head. That will strengthen his hands so much he cannot be stripped of the ball when going up underneath to score. I cannot remember any 1 player so easily and so repeatedly stripped of the ball for his entire career as has Watford. How much more valuable he would be if he could only hang onto the ball.

  • Mike P. #7


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 10:23 AM EDT

    Victor is a 6th man? Really? What effing rock have you been under? Victor is repeatedly talked about as a National POY candidate.

    Please tell me that was a typo and not just stupidity.

    HC,

    To bad they didn’t do that with CW a couple years ago, at this point it is too late to do the Hoosiers any good.

  • Chet #8


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 10:32 AM EDT

    “swaheelie”

    Let’s go with Swahili, though, since it was first written in Arabic script, I can’t claim it’s the only spelling.

    Interesting, your choice of a language. It’s widely used (three times more people speak it than speak Greek) yet you use it like an insult.

  • Laffy #9


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 10:44 AM EDT

    No, Watford played like an NBA Hall of Famer.

    It was ALL the refs’ fault.

    Just ask the “experts” on here.

    (rolleyes)

    All our turnovers?

    It was the “refs screwing us.”

  • AWinAZ #10


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 11:57 AM EDT

    Let’s examine the statistics of turnovers.

    If you assume both teams shoot 50% (or 40% from 3), for every TO you commit, you surrender 1 point for your opponent and -1 point that you would’ve had. That is a 2 point differential, on average, and it usually works out pretty close to that.

    Last night, we had 14 TOs, officially, not counting the lost possessions on balls of the hands out of bounds, etc…. Illinois had 10, really a paltry total for a team at the bottom of the Big 10. It goes to show you how much real defense we played.

    Regardless, 14 TOs – 10 TOs = 4 TO differential x 2 pts. per = 8 pts. lost. This would be “typical”.

    Last night Illinois scored 28 pts. off of our turnovers. Plus we gave up 4 more possessions, or 4 more points.

    Cumulative, last night, TOs accounted for a roughly 32 pt. difference instead of just 8! Flat out Astounding and purely the reason we lost the contest.

    This has been a problem all season. Granted, we usually push the ball enough to overcome those possessions lost and we normally apply enough pressure to put the TO battle in our favor. Last night it didn’t happen….and then some!

    And a stunning, yes stunning, lack of taking the ball to the rim and drawing fouls in the last 5 min. We had 2 pts in the last 3 min, and those were on Oladipo’s layup with 55 sec. to go. Again, total lack of execution.

  • hiensohn #11


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 11:59 AM EDT

    Yes there is complaining about a loss.Would you say it is deserved?Last week I wrote,we played 3 fantastic games in a row and THAT is what championship teams do.We should not have lost this game and I was placing the blame where I felt it belonged.Our guys play hard and often need a break.If you want them to play hard all the time,you have to use your bench.

  • Laffy #12


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 12:25 PM EDT

    Excellent analysis, AZ.

  • Larry #13


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 12:42 PM EDT

    I have been one to always praise Crean on his coaching decisions but 2 incidents come to mind last night. 1) how is it there were absolutely no IU defenders near the basket? Did they have that much confidence that a .9 sec hail mary was gonna go down hence the man to man near the hash mark? What was Cody doing at the hash mark???

    And I don’t as a former youth baseball coach tolerate arrogant behavior, ie Sheehey flexing his biceps at Purdue which drew Creans attention and “talk”. Last night his dunk and trashtalk to a player afterwards got him a technical, hence 2 dumb ass (as I call them) pts.

  • Laffy #14


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 12:59 PM EDT

    Here’s at least the second game this season where Cody should have dominated…….and he vanished instead.

    So don’t tell me how “great” he is and/or what a “great” coach Crean is.

    If Cody isn’t going to take over in the games he should kick butt, sit his butt and let Hanner get some experience.

    Every coach in the world says the bench is the best motivator.

    Well……use it.

    And sit Watford and let Jeremy play more too.

  • Tom #15


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 1:57 PM EDT

    Sheehey’s “bad-guy wrestling” attitude is wearing thin with me. He doesn’t even start, yet he acts like he’s the man.

    The kid needs to learn to make a play and move on. Quit celebrating like you’ve never done it before. I wouldn’t mind seeing a Big Ten frontcourt player just lay him out once after one of those “celebrations.”

    I don’t want to hear that he needs it to motivate himself. Grow up, Sheehey.

  • Podunker #16


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 2:53 PM EDT

    I hope IU does not recover the #1 ranking for the remainder of the season. I’d like them to be a #1 seed in the tourney, but not be ranked #1 again. They can’t handle it. They don’t have the mentality to be the bully, to dominate weaker teams, to finish a team when they’re up by 11 points in the second half. Their DNA is to be the hunters. They can’t handle the pressure of being the hunted. Too many of this team’s players identify as the underdogs and they’re comfortable with that.

    The last five minutes of yesterday’s game was a joke. They need to be toughened up. And for the love of God, when the opposing team’s center fouls out of the game, give the ball to Zeller. How simple can that directive be? Twice they’ve failed to do that, and lost the game both times. Ridiculous.

  • coachv #17


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 2:58 PM EDT

    sheehey did not trash talk. all he did was make a surprised face while looking at the illini player. nor did he get in the player’s face as the ref indicated to crean. when that became a tech eludes me.

  • Podunker #18


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 3:10 PM EDT

    Tom, did you really just say you “wouldn’t mind” an opposing player injuring Will Sheehey? When you wrote “lay him out,” what did you mean by that? Does that mean knock him unconscious? Because, according to my understanding, when you “lay someone out,” that means knocking them out, knocking them unconscious. Which usually means giving someone a concussion. That’s pretty sick, Tom. You need to be careful with those types of comments.

    I don’t like some of Sheehey’s antics either, but I would never want to see an opposing player “lay out” an IU player, especially for such silly and harmless gestures. You need to think about what you just wrote Tom, because frankly, what you suggested is far worse than any gesture Sheehey has made on a basketball court. If you stand by that comment in #15, then maybe its time you stop identifying yourself as a Hoosier Fan.

  • Laffy #19


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 3:26 PM EDT

    I agree 100% with post # 16.

    As far as Will, that’s exactly why I hated his hot dog crap. You get a reputation. So even when you didn’t “cross the line”, refs are going to look for anything they can to hit you with so things do not get out of control.

    Especially at a place where the fans HATE the other team.

    Their fans could see that as taunting and start hurling insults at Will, which he admits he gets them to do on purpose, and then he starts pulling his crap with them back, they yell more and the next thing you know, he’s flipping off their fans and a fight breaks out.

    Will brought it all on himself.

    As far as “laying Will out”, I took it as putting him on his butt hard………not “giving him a concussion.”

    And what he does isn’t “harmless.” Heck, when I say Cody played like a girl, which is harmless, this place goes CRAZY.

    There’s a reason ALL sports ban taunting the other side and their fans. It’s not “harmless” at all.

  • Podunker #20


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 4:57 PM EDT

    If its not harmless, it must be harmful. How is what Sheehey does harmful? Is he injuring someone? Is he traumatizing other players? Is it mental torture? I don’t like what he does, but I don’t think it hurts anyone or anything. If anything, it pumps up the opposing players and rouses the crowd, so it may be detrimental to IU’s goal of winning the game. Is that what you mean when you say “it’s not harmless?” If so, that’s a stretch.

  • Tom #21


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 6:05 PM EDT

    Lay him out = blindside screen him to the ground.

    Sorry for the strong words, but his antics are getting real old with me.

  • Larry #22


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 6:26 PM EDT

    coachv, were you courtside? It’s clear Sheehey said something, I had no idea what that was from watching it on tv, so unless you were courtside & could here the verbal exchange, you’re speculating.

  • Larry #23


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 6:30 PM EDT

    Laffy, I was always taught & taught my son & he was taught by his varsity baseball coach that trashtalkin & showboatin were “OUT”. You do you speaking with your game, expend that energy used on playing & focusing on the game at hand, period!!!!

  • Laffy #24


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 6:35 PM EDT

    Podunker, then why does the NFL and NBA ban taunting?

    They’re “just having fun too”, right?

    Can’t even wag a finger in someone’s face.

    It sure is funny how you guys brush that off as “nothing” yet GO OFF THE DEEP END if I say Cody played like a girl….yet that is “harmless” too.

  • Laffy #25


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 6:39 PM EDT

    Exactly, Larry.

    Maybe if Will wasn’t running his mouth so much, he would have got a rebound.

    Will thinks he’s “tough” because he can flap his gums, prance around like a tween girl at a Beiber concert after a 3, and flex his muscles at the crowd.

    No, shut up and go get a rebound in a crowd.

    Or stop a guy from getting an uncontested lay-up to win the game after you choked away your lead.

    THAT is “tough.”

    He’s probably my least favorite player ever.

  • Harvard for Hillbillies #26


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 6:54 PM EDT

    14 TOs – 10 TOs = 4 TO differential x 2 pts. per = 8 pts.

    AWinAZ-

    Didn’t IU have 16 points off turnovers? Don’t you have to subtract subtract 16(IU) from 28(Illinois) to get the net difference of 12?

    28-16 = 12 = Points of Turnovers advantage for Illinois.

    Your original computation, a correct computation(14 TOs – 10 TOs = 4 TO differential x 2 pts. per = 8 pts)that resulted in the 8 point differential, was only 4 points below the actual difference in the box score of 12 points(28-16).

    Even adding the 4 points you claim as “lost possession” points, wouldn’t the total cumulative difference be 16(12 + 4) instead of the whopping 32 points that you claim as the total? How do you claim a ‘cumulative difference’ of 28 points off turnovers in your second set of computations without accounting for IU’s 16 POTs and subsequently subtracting that number from the 28 POT’s number for Illinois?

    16 fewer points(includes your lost possession points)off turnovers is a sizable discrepancy, but it’s sure not 32.

    And couldn’t you account for any Indiana points to pad their POT total as a result of lost possessions for Illinois?

  • TsaoTsuG #27


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 7:20 PM EDT

    Sorry Podunker, I disagree and think you may have it backwards. The Hoosiers are fine when they’ve seen themselves as the ‘hunted’, they’ve answered the call in the tournament, vs Minnesota, vs Michigan State, vs Michigan when they felt they were playing teams hunting them down and targeting them. What they’ve been unable to do is hunt prey down, wound it, pursue it, track it and kill it as in Butler, Wisconsin, Illinois.

    That is a reflection of a team that in 2011-2012 played the entire year to survive; and has shown this entire year hunger is not part of its motivation. They are now the Hunter, fully equipped and dressed at Needham Marcus (aka Needless Markups), Orvis and Abercombie & Fitch on Michigan Ave, but no need to survive.

  • Harvard for Hillbillies #28


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 7:44 PM EDT

    If you let it define you, it will. You put the loss behind you and head to OSU with a clean slate.

    There isn’t a team in the nation that has high intensity game in and game out.

    We had plenty of ugly losses last season(Minny at home..@ Nebraska)and it didn’t stop us from making a Sweet 16 tournament run. The rematch with the most talented team in the country was likely the only thing standing in are path a Final Four…or maybe even a long shot at capturing a championship.

    I think we’ll see bumps in the road throughout the rest of the Big 10 season. I don’t think first place is totally out of the picture. There will be more upsets and Michigan will likely do a bit of their own stumbling on the road before all is said and done.

    The Hoosiers will be hungry in March. We’re a very talented basketball team. Nothing wrong with being humbled occasionally by an opponent that doesn’t buy into your swagger and rankings.

    Hopefully, these few bitter pills will not be forgotten when we face teams in the tournament that will not give a hoot if they’re playing the newly resurrected, mighty, Indiana Hoosiers.

    I predicted six regular season losses. I think that number will be very close to the actual. The last two weeks of the season will be perfectly brutal; another nice big slice of humble pie if we lose a few tough ones on the road. The Establishment doubters will crawl back out of the woodwork as we enter the first round of the Dance. I like the scenario of a slightly wounded ego and some collective anger in the bellies a team hungry to prove they can live up to the early billing.

  • Harvard for Hillbillies #29


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 7:48 PM EDT

    …the only thing standing in [our] path to a Final Four

  • TsaoTsuG #30


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 7:49 PM EDT

    How is it harmful? It is a form of ‘representing’, directly imported from the ‘hood (Black, White, Latino and Oriental); it is about as innocent as ‘tagging’ the walls in south Chicago.

    Here’s a story…back about 10 years ago Chicago cops who were born and raised in the neighborhoods started ‘representing’ their ‘homies’ at each other during morning formation at the Shakespeare (13th PD) district (mid-northwest side not far from Roberto Clemente HS and Wells HS.

    (They also carried it to their basketball games). They would do it in the AM and then the PM. Cop cars started being ‘tagged’ (they were quickly painted over…but it happened). Eventually a riot broke out between the cops who had been representing their ‘youth’ id’s. Two were injured enough to be taken to the hospital.

    I like Sheehey…have always felt he has uncommon talent and physical traits. I also think he’s quote intelligent. However, it seems to me that he often plays for the University of Sheehey. I think Oladipo may end up one of the greatest ball players to wear Hoosier Crimson. His development has been unbelievable. I enjoy his spirit but not his ‘representing’.

    And, I believe that while last year the Hoosiers were driven by a warrior culture and a team’s ‘sense of embarrassment’, that same sense is not there now. That is the difference between why we loved last year’s Hoosiers and we are finding it so hard to love this team. We’re still trying to get over the embarrassment of the last decade; with the exception of Wattford and Jordan Hulls and a couple of players who are not getting much playing time (Elston, Maurice), this team runs on virgin mode. Its leaders, those that create the feeling, have never felt violated.

    We, many of us fans do, remember it, and never forget it.

  • Harvard for Hillbillies #31


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 7:55 PM EDT

    Let it go. Let Knight go. Let Sampson go.

    These players have their own personalities and their own drive to succeed. I believe they have a much stronger bond to each other than you give them credit.

    I get pissed at Sheehey sometimes, but I don’t see him as not wanting the best for his teammates.

  • Larry #32


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 8:01 PM EDT

    I agree, this team will be ok, heck, KI wonder if the fans of the other #1 teams that got knocked feel the same way some think on this forum, ready to bash their team at any costs.

  • TsaoTsuG #33


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 8:02 PM EDT

    “…quote intelligent”…should read “quite intelligent”.

    The cop “gang” riot took place during a morning formation. That evening cops were brought to the PM formation. The district commander was reassigned about a month later. There was a huge week long story in one of the city’s dailies titled “Cops in Gangs” that among other issues discovered the neighborhood gangs were telling its younger members to keep their records ‘clean’ so they could eventually become cops.

    I also believe there are different ‘attitudes about attitudes’ on this Indiana team; and that some of the players do not quite know how to handle some of the more ‘effervescent’ attitudes and this may be diluting the one outstanding legacy from last year’s Hoosiers…the unity that came from the fight to reclaim their dignity as a team.

  • TsaoTsuG #34


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 8:17 PM EDT

    See Harvard, most missed the point with RMK. Whatever it was, (fear, hate, anger) it brought the team together each and every day because they could only survive as “one” against him. He made a point of having them fight him at each and every practice. Landon Turner’s travails were a huge part of Ray Tolbert’s life. Wittman spent part of his life counseling Isaiah Thomas into surviving Knight….

    And Knight knew it. Soldiers do not battle for country or flag or glory and least of all pay. They battle for each other to survive and get to go home, as whole as possible. This culture is impossible to recreate on an NCAA team, but teams are successful or not depending on how close they get to replicating that feeling.

    Right now, life is way too happy on Fee Lane.

  • TsaoTsuG #35


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 8:29 PM EDT

    Larry, don’t fall into the trap of believing that critiquing the Hoosiers is ‘bashing’ them. I agreed with every bit of the advice you passed on to your son. If there’s a place for ‘athletics’ in major parts of our lives it is in their role in teaching values that are not so readily taught without the stress and pressure that athletic competition brings.

    I’m not sure that’s not missing in the ‘rare air’ the Hoosiers have been breathing since the end of last season. Somehow it seems to me it is air…without the “oxygen” that made us so special and hangs on the five banners at Assembly Hall. Ask yourself, which team would have won between last year’s and this year’s team. I would have bet on last year’s team. That team would have won last night’s game.

    But Larry…we do agree on what traits one wants to emphasize and build in our kids. They are the same of character, respect, self respect, perseverance and integrity in every effort. That, is not bashing.

  • Harvard for Hillbillies #36


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 8:48 PM EDT

    I think they’ll come together, Tsao.

    I do like your take on how a team’s personality can develop. I saw Hanner putting his arm around Remy’s shoulder during one of the timeouts last night.

    It’s the little things, the small gestures of brotherhood, you must look for amongst the heartbreak a tough loss.

    Just because fear as a motivator worked for Knight, doesn’t make it the best method for this coach with his own set of motivational skills and personality strengths.

    How quickly we forget how we never looked so unintimidated the site of Mackey this season. What transpired in West Lafayette can serve just as inexplicable in its inspired glory as Champaign-Urbana in its lackluster bewilderment.

    It’s college basketball. The trend this year appears to gravitate toward expecting the unexpected. Maybe it’s a cultural phenomenon… Maybe many these young and talented athletes are making way too much of the hype always at their doorstep. I don’t think the Indiana Hoosiers are the only bunch guilty of believing too much in the created image sold in national sports columns and rankings courtesy the so-called experts.

    Kids of the 70′s weren’t subjected to the type of hype surrounding every name and every game now present in the daily diet a college athlete. These guys are rock stars like never before..This isn’t the days of tuning into most the games on a black and white portable TV and a fuzzy channel 4. Exposure, exposure, and more exposure. It can’t be easy to stay grounded when so many are pushing your ego to the clouds.

    Maybe we see more of tripping(Elston @ Northwestern pun intended)because it’s all so much under a microscopic examination. We no longer are outside viewers the media world. We have become the media and with that power we forget that we could likely be perceived as faltering in no lesser degree under such constant scrutiny.

  • Harvard for Hillbillies #37


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 9:01 PM EDT

    And could that national and regional exposure that is so prevalent for almost every Big 10 game televised serve to help the labeled underdog when facing a favored team?

    Illinois was playing Goliath under the lights a nationally televised game. Do you think coach Groce could get the same level of motivation out his underdog team when the waving his arms to get everyone fired up would be watched by a mere 4000 viewers on channel 4 instead of the 400,000 on ESPN’s “PRIMETIME GAME NIGHT!?”

  • Harvard for Hillbillies #38


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 9:15 PM EDT

    You can’t get out on the roads and drive two miles without someone honking their horn, riding your butt, while engulfed in an ego trip riding 10 feet above the ground as they bully you on the blacktop in their gigantic SUV. They trip out over their power behind the wheel of a stupid vehicle…Any we’re criticizing an a 10-year-old kid for getting a little carried away when he dunks a basketball.

    Adults on the roadways put people’s lives at risk everyday with their bullying and taunting behind the wheel a 6000 pound hunk of metal under their big feet on tiny gas pedal.

    We should all collectively look in the mirror..examine our public own behaviors and barreling out our chests these “in your face” times, before we crucify a kid for getting too excited his own surprise in he owns the lane on a harmless court of maple.

  • Harvard for Hillbillies #39


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 9:16 PM EDT

    oops. ….a [19-year-old] kid

  • AWinAZ #40


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 9:26 PM EDT

    Hrvd, you are correct in subtracting IUs POT. I didn’t have that stat for my post. The actual differential is indeed 16 pts now if IU scored 16 off of their 10 TO.

    I was just pointing out that we “gave” them 32 pts. They “gave” us 16 per your quoted stat.

    Bottom line is that the TO stat WAS the diff. in this game, against a bad defending team.

  • Chet #41


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 10:25 PM EDT

    The advent of social media has certainly changed the ego equation in the world on amateur sport. With a little luck it will all crash and burn.

    TTG, you are absolutely correct, you don’t fight for God or for country. You fight for the guy standing next to you. Of course, in that setting, social media has zero importance.

    They’ll be OK. Or not. I hope they win the Big Ten and, then, the whole shebang. But it’s not what will define their lives.

    I hope.

  • Podunker #42


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 10:31 PM EDT

    Tsao; the “how is it harmful” question is being taken out of context. I was originally referring to Sheehey’s gestures not be harmful relative to Tom’s comment suggesting an opposing player “lay him out.” I don’t like Sheehey’s gestures at all. I think they’re stupid and juvenile. But I do not consider them taunting because I have never seen him direct the gesture at an opposing player. I have never seen him get in an opposing player’s face for the purpose of taunting that player. If he had, or if a ref had interpreted his gestures as taunting, I’m pretty sure the refs would have called a technical foul on Sheehey. To my knowledge, they have not done that. Regardless (taunting is in the eye of the beholder) whatever it is Sheehey’s doing is not “harmful” relative to laying some out.

    Whether IU is comfortable being the hunted or being the hunter, they don’t seem to handle being ranked #1 very well. They don’t seem to have the collective mentality necessary to finish weaker opponents off after establishing a double digit lead. Watching the last five minutes of yesterday’s game, you could see the IU players handing the momentum over to Illinois. You could just watch them unravel before your eyes. And almost all of the starters were guilty of making stupid mistake (I don’t remember Hulls screwing up). Whatever the cause, they need to toughen up and learn to pound a weaker team into submission, especially when they’re on the road, playing in front of hostile crowds.

    It’s easy to criticize Crean, and some of that criticism may be valid, but yesterday, IU’s players lost that game. One of those players is going to need to step up, take control, and tell his teammates, “we’re not going to blow this f*#@ing lead!”

  • iamahoosier #43


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 10:40 PM EDT

    Indiana Who-osiers….unpredictable, unreliable, inconsistent, hell I’m wearing my Thesaurus out!

    The hot potato that is the #1 ranking in NCAA BB continued this week as IU became the 5th consecutive to team to relinquish the top spot in less than a week. I could see it coming the day the 2013 schedule was released. There it was, 2-7-13 ( my 60th BD) @ Illinois….ugh! This was going to be a day to be remembered and believe me when I say I won’t soon forget it.

    I would put this performance in the top 5 biggest gags in my decades long love affair with the Hoosiers. Sure there are always ups and downs…that’s what it’s all about. The ups- ’76-’81-’87…need I say more. I’ve always said my attendance at the 87 title game was one of the highlights of my life. One of my fondest memories. I guess it takes these highs to make the lows of yesterdays loss hit so hard. I don’t expect to win every game, though I do feel this team should be undefeated at this point. I expect to lose Sunday @ OSU and probably 3 more times before it’s over….@ MSU, MI and MN.

    I don’t enjoy any loss, but some are to be expected and Big 10 road games always prove a tough challenge. If your going to win a Big 10 title you have to win your home games and the road games with teams that don’t have the talent to compete…..unless you cooperate and hand it to them like I U did yesterday. 16 turnovers to a team that doesn’t present any particular defensive problems is a gift. A gift that likely cost them any chance at the regular season top spot and #1 Big 10 Tournament top seed. Only the winner of the Big 10 Tournament will get a #1 NCAA seed.

    This years NCAA Tournament promises to be one of the most competitive in years. There is no clear cut top team and every team in the top 20 presents a difficult challenge. A top seed will be very valuable and much coveted….good luck Who-osiers- you’re going to need it!

  • Chet #44


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 10:43 PM EDT

    I couldn’t tell what Will said. Perhaps it was a terribly heinous 0.8 second outburst. That being said, just by my terribly unsophisticated observation of numerous replays, it appeared to be an overreaction on the part of the official.

    Of course, that would belie the understood infallibility of Big Ten officiating.

  • Harvard for Hillbillies #45


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 10:59 PM EDT

    iamahoosier-

    Why are you posting your same comment on different threads?

    Dustin- Slap a Scoop technical on iamhoosier for excessive hot dog posting.

    I would also like an excessive Establishment taunting technical served up on Jeremy for his going Kellenberger all-caps hypercritical “COMMENTARY” today.

  • TsaoTsuG #46


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 10:59 PM EDT

    Podunker, I completely agree with you (#42). I want to make sure you know that if I appear to comment on your comments more often than others, it is because I respect your attitudes, your support, your tolerance for other views and the serious thought at the heart of your commentary. I enjoy giving thought to your ideas and observations; whether they agree with mine or when they cause me to respond from another point of view.

  • Harvard for Hillbillies #47


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 11:18 PM EDT

    The advent of social media has certainly changed the ego equation in the world on amateur sport. With a little luck it will all crash and burn.

    Couldn’t agree more, Chet. There is nothing “social” about social media. It functions as temptation an addiction the the self. Enhance the self..romance the self…compare the self…display the self…make prettier the self than the self really is…write extensively about the self as if the self would actually be written about by anyone else but the self…place selected spectacularly flattering photos the self…bore the world with the unoriginality the self and the hobbies the self…show the all that the self is sophisticated in all things others unsophisticated….proclaim the self to be a wholly satisfied and delightful self…sell the self outside the view the eyes to determine a normally uninteresting self….care only about the image of the self while telling all how much the self is loved and followed by all the friends interested in the self.

    Sounds “social” to me. There isn’t a more hideous disease infecting all of mankind than the virus of “me is the world” that spewed out that impotent toad named Zuckerberg. A face is a face….And its advertisement in space is not a book.

  • coachv #48


    Friday, February 8, 2013 - 11:48 PM EDT

    larry

    i was not courtside but i saw a replay that showed the entirety of the dunk and will made the Oooo face as he was coming off the rim and the illini player happened to be facing will as he landed. sure will looked at him but he did not move toward the player. just a look of mock surprise should not warrant a T in my opinion. will’s lips did not move so i don’t think he said anything. i’m sure will’s rep played a major factor. crean was watching and had to ask the ref why he was t’d up. the ref said will got in the other player’s face. not that he said anything.

    that being said, i would never stand for the posing and preening will and victor do but i’m old fashioned that way.

  • elmo #49


    Saturday, February 9, 2013 - 8:37 AM EDT

    Podunker, you need to stick to your kniting,its clear you know nothing about basketball. You are just on here to nitpik other bloggers. Be sure and write back one of your clever bolgs.

  • Terryz #50


    Saturday, February 9, 2013 - 11:50 AM EDT

    Victor and Hulls would be a great spark off the bench. Nothing on this offense makes sense.
    Was Watford passing the pipe all summer? To Crean and Hulls?.
    No defense – too slow to stop dribble penetrate, slow help side, if ever.
    Victor was never any better than 6 man in HS, take your blinders off, stop watching shiny objects. Watch the players, not the run and gun NBA game we are too slow and too unskilled to play that game. Discipline e.g.Butler and Wisconsin proved that.
    This will be an early out in the tourney if we don’t correct the many flaws.
    I know good basketball, and this isn’t it.
    Crawl back under your boulder

  • Laffy #51


    Saturday, February 9, 2013 - 12:19 PM EDT

    TT…..loved post # 30. University of Sheehey, indeed.

    Podunker….There was a pic earlier of Will doing his “3 to the temple thing” and staring DIRECTLY at a player. And, he also taunts the crowd and said it is his goal to get them to chant “Sheehey sucks.”

    And why do you give a free pass to Crean for the loss? When Cody wasn’t getting the ball…..again………why didn’t Crean demand they do it or sit their azz?

    Sounds like he needs to go back to the practice where a basket doesn’t count if Cody doesn’t at least touch it.

  • Laffy #52


    Saturday, February 9, 2013 - 12:25 PM EDT

    It just occurred to me:

    Many people say that a big problem with lots of kids is that their parents try to be “friends” with their kids instead of their parents.

    That’s what Crean is doing: being a “friend” instead of a coach.

    And that’s why they’re soft.

    Just like when kids don’t have REAL “parents”, they don’t grow up with the discipline they need.

    Crean wants to be liked by the players too much. Yes, it helps with recruiting because they LOVE him, but it hurts them in the long run.

    Too much hot-dogging and not mentally tough.

    Maybe he knows, deep down, he sucks as a coach and has to get the best talent to have any chance at winning.

    But he’s not doing them any favors by rolling over all the time and refusing to hold them accountable.

    Crean should tell them if they don’t pass t Cody inside when he has a clear advantage, he’s playing the walk-ons.

    We all think Hoosiers is the best movie ever. And one reason is because Coach only played 4 players one game to prove a point.

  • Larry #53


    Saturday, February 9, 2013 - 12:58 PM EDT

    Soft??? It’s amazing to see “HOOSIER” fans on here making a statement about this team being soft, being whatever. They have beat every ranked opponent they have played this year, loss to a few teams that moved into and up the rankings at a later time or was once ranked.

    Why is it that posters make this statement? Lose & their a soft bunch of kids. Believe me, they have way too many wins to consider them soft. Lack of “intensity” is more like it. It is so very difficult to stay physically emotional up for every game, this game is far more demanding both physical & emotional than it was 10+ years ago. The incredible pace in which IU plays at is brutally physical.

    I would have more concern had these other top 5 teams that made it to #1 kept on winning but they’re not, they have lost to cupcake teams so to speak. I guess our Hoosiers are simply normal this year.

  • Lord of the Bad Caw-Caw!! #54


    Saturday, February 9, 2013 - 12:58 PM EDT

    Oh, no…Anxiety is setting in. I’m already having premonitions of Matta and the swarming OSU defense upon our stagnant offense.

  • Lord of the Bad Caw-Caw!! #55


    Saturday, February 9, 2013 - 1:36 PM EDT

  • Laffy #56


    Saturday, February 9, 2013 - 1:37 PM EDT

    Yes, soft.

    There has been at least 2 games where Cody had a clear advantage and vanished both times.

    No killer instinct…..at all.

    Try reading the national media someday….they ALL call Cody soft. Now, you’ll just cry “they’re out to get us and know nothing”, but they aren’t biased like you are.

    Most of those wins came against Cupcake City, so “number of wins” doesn’t impress me too much.

    And spare me “the game is tougher now” baloney.

  • Larry #57


    Saturday, February 9, 2013 - 2:31 PM EDT

    Sorry Laffy, I didn’t realize you were “the one” that knows it all. I didn’t realize either that with all the weight training and physically demanding aspect of the game is actually less physical than what it was years ago. How stupid of me!! Hahaha!!!! I didn’t realize that with the original initiation of the :45 clock and now the :35 clock that the game has actually slowed tenfold, how stupid of me on that one also. The implementation of weight training years ago & guards with 16-18″ biceps actually made the game softer today. Dang, missed out on another one there. That many players now use mouth guards since the game is actually less physically demanding than years, dang, whoda thunk it?

  • Laffy #58


    Saturday, February 9, 2013 - 3:18 PM EDT

    Never said I “knew it all”, so don’t start in with that nonsense again.

    You think the game wasn’t physical 10 years ago because kids didn’t have mouth guards?

    Bwahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!

    Years ago, the tall guys played mostly inside banging each other.

    Now, they love shooting from outside more.

    Yeah, Buckner and Isiah were such sissies.

    LOL!!

    And what does that have to do with Cody being soft anyway?

    Are you really telling me you think every writer is “out to get us” by saying Cody is soft?

    Really?

    LOL!!!

Scoop Poll:

Can the Hoosiers make a bowl game without Nate Sudfeld?

View Results

Loading ... Loading ...

IU vs Michigan State Football

  • Rico Chet:

    ^ I also like this! [...]

  • 15 miles North:

    Speaking of Hoosier Hysteria - Happy Birthday to 'The General'. [...]

  • t:

    A better shot of making it at iu. Examples: James banks was better th [...]

  • t:

    However, sometimes big time fb recruit s from Indiana go to big time f [...]

  • Harvard for Hillbillies:

    Something that Ron(Scoop blogger that used to be known as "t-s [...]

  • t:

    Looks like iu will continue to struggle at Qb position in future. Ste [...]

  • Harvard for Hillbillies:

    Don't worry about it...I pretty much knew you were typing that 'Pulitz [...]


Find Notre Dame football coverage on NDInsider.com. © Hoosier Times Inc., all rights reserved.